KB-X who's upto the challenge!?

This is open to all who are interested, KB-X is full contact rules (kicks above waist) in shorts 10oz gloves with knees and spinning back fists

Limited clinch for knee strike, strike and release

3x3 min rounds 8 man tournament minimum £1500 1st place prize

The majority of fighters interested will Dictate what weight the 8 man will be, simply most interest will Be the first one in England who will
Be the pioneers

Standard tickets will be £25
Ticket commission £5
Sell over 30 get £150 purse plus comission plus £1500 for winner

It's new it's fesh and it will pay all fighters fairly who's interested I know of some already

jondgreen@hotmail.com

No! Moon boots and shins

KB-X!
Extreme full contact kickboxing

If your doing an 8man it has to be min £3000 winner fee.
£5000 is the norm.
Also if your doing knees you might as well put lowkicks in.
You will get more interest by K1 & Muay Thai fighters as well as kickboxers.
If you do that if be interested -80kg or -85kg

I think it's a good format, gives Full Contact a little bit of edge and also promotes high kicking which is a skill in itself. I really don't enjoy seeing fights stopped with leg kicks, but that's just me.

£1500 is minimum more bums on seats means bigger purses and prize funds!

It's not K1 low kicks isn't for everyone, knees are an exciting part, KB-X is a new concept the prize fund is realistic do I as a promoter can put a show on with fair purses more sales more money

8 x 30 = 240 x £20 = £4800 hmmm £5000 grand purse lol

I'd be lucky if all 8 sold 30 tickets as an average so simple business I will pay more on reflection of sales

The concept is there who wants to be there, good points by the way I'm just saying where I am at, I'd love to put this on

I have organised a few grandprix tournaments myself. Although they are classed as 8 man event, usually you have 10 - as a reserve fight is sometimes needed - with the winner participating should there be a drop out from the original 8 seeded fighters on the night, should a winner of a bout withdraw due to injury.

Best of luck with it!

Hi Neil that what in the mix as injury is bound to happen

I must say this is not just an 8 man event I'm more than happy to match 1-1 bouts under these rules, but obviously won't be a large purse just one of purse plus commission

So anyone interested if can match 1-1 or fill an 8 man send me your stats I'd realistically like to host this event the November which allows ample time to prep

Another hairbrained scheme dragonfoot, what is the point in this? Its K1 without low kicks. Will never take off - i'll be amazed if it even happens. Why no low kicks but still have knees? Just weird. NEVER EVER EVER take off!

have a 67kg lad interested

Another ?

Liam happily have him aboard this show will initially be a not for profit event this will purely be done to get these rules under way some don't like to be kicked in the legs and some want to test themselves in a tough sport the fast clean pace of full contact made more extreme by removal of the feet and shin pads

Dick you do know it's not safe for trolls now website have an obligation to identify you if requested, hmmm claim some respect and reveal yourself lol

its not really extreme
if you're not going to have elbows then you should allow headbutts and kicks to the goolies

No elbows

If spinning back fist and knees plus the pace and flamboyance of FC not enough for you then this isn't for you ;-)

I'd do it 60kg

Put low kicks in as well as knees/spinning back fist and keep it to k1 style rules.
Its more interesting and the format works.
Kickboxers still have advantage of boxing and speed and thaiboxers can use power and aggression.

I gotta admit i do enjoy K1 rules, however, i know a lot of people that don't like training leg kicks or take them. I have never liked leg kicks. I think this is a good concept for full contact fighters to advance to increasing their arsenal and removing the much slated 'moon boots'.

Does not need to have low kick, K1 stands alone and is great for what it is, this is taking full contact to another level

Trousers removed
Feet and shins removed
Rounds compacted
Round times increased
This will be explosive

The mixture of boxing and flash full contact kicks and devastating well timed spinning back fists and punishing knee strikes

Winner winner chicken dinner! In my eyes???

KB-X is the brand name by the way ;-)

I will be doing a mail shot to 1000 or so contacts I have, I am already receiving emails from Spain, Germany, Italy and France the Europeans want to come over are there any more Brits than the 3 mentioned who are all welcome I'd like to at least run it for 12 months before international events

Dean Alexander 64.5kg

Always welcome up north Carl you may enjoy it and not want to go back tho ;-)

I do get that may appeal to some with the leg kick element, but I just am not one to be kicked in the leg don't like it one bit, I suppose to make it hard core could include the foot stomp if scoring to legs counts, should not stamping on feet and toes? Also score to the arms if attacking limbs is the buzz!

Winding up now but head and body are what I like to attack kicking in legs is like a fowl to me but only my opinion x

What makes you think i'll even come....

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should put it in.

I was classed a Kickboxer and now do K1 and have won 2 World titles and beaten some of the best in the world.
Wont really go back to KB unless defending my Kickboxing World titles.

Condition yourself that's all you have to do lol.
Lowkicks are a good weapon to disable mobility that way you would get more Thaiboxers wanting to compete to try and stop the fluidity and speed of Kickboxers.
Original Kickboxing had lowkicks in anyway, otherwise you should call it Freestyle Karate Extreme, or Extreme Freestyle Karate.

I dont get you want knees but no lowkicks!!
No boots and shins which means Shin Conditioning but no Lowkicks because people dont want to condition Thighs!!
Also is it going to be no clinch and points score more over power and aggression to lean towards kickboxers than Thaiboxers?

I think you need a good rule set that is equal for Kick and Thaiboxers otherwise you wont get many that want to do it thats why the K1 Rules are good.

Clinch and 1 Technique (Knee, Kick, Punch, Throw)
Lowkicks
Stomps
Spinning Backfist
Continuous fighting.

Points scored for Power and Aggression, but also defence and counter
Points deducted for running away
No points scored for tippy tappy techniques

A lot of big named orgs are already changing Full Contact Kickboxing by shortening the rounds (5x3 or 7x2) to get fighters to be more aggressive and with shorts and without boots etc.

Maybe that is the way you should go, same rules just shorter rounds and different equipment.

And wasnt KBX 8 man already tried before when they tried getting Lex Easdon, John Orchard Fran Zucalla and some others together in a Middleweight 8 man comp, but it never happened?

http://youtu.be/PyF2tZB0lUA

Some intresting points. Marlon raises some good ones about scoring.

I gave up Full Contact cause I no longer agree with the direction it is taking, ie judging, scoring etc it just became boring and by making the whole thing more professional, put it out of reach of most people. Good amateurs soon realise they have to train 6 days a week to fight 10 rounds for no money, a recipie for ruin if ever I saw one.

I like less rounds. 10 rounds is boring to me with to many technical fights which no one is really interested in. Full Contact is rooted to the spot when other sports are adapting to become more appealing.

Give it a go Jon but heres one point you might want to consider. By taking out the low kick elements, you wont get many Thai/K1 style fighters intrested. By including kness and no shinnies, you are limiting how many FC fighters you will attract. Do you get it? You're kinda stuck in the middle.

Again Marlon has handed you the key. Put the low kicks in but change the scoring criteria to achieve the result that you and hopefully the public want to see. Make your USP the rule set that will give the styles a chance to meet in the middle.

I would love you to get some of those karate/Tae kwon Do guys in there in they're suits and black belts to. Be great fun and a whole new market for you.

My point exactly Mark.

Rules needs to be suitable and easily adaptable for all with rules that suit all styles best techniques that way you will get more styles wanting to compete.

Thai/K1 can still knee and lowkick, just cant clinch for ages or elbow.
Kickboxers/Boxers/Karate/TKD etc can use boxing, high kicking skills and speed just need to condition legs and adapt for lowkicks and knees.

More styles involved = more exiting unpredictable bouts
Just imagine an 8 man with top practitioners at the same weight ie
Thaiboxer
K1
Kickboxer
Boxer
Katate
TKD
Kung Fu
Savate

Fighting 3x3 with extra round if a draw.

Keep to Thai or Board shorts and 10 oz gloves as old UFC tried their own equipment and even though it was great, insurance wise would be a nightmare and thats why they changed.

Kung Fu TKD don't use gloves so means they could fight without, Savate wears shoes, Kickboxers, Boots, TKD Gi's which means pushkicks could get caught up in Gi etc etc

Hi Jon. Do you have a date in mind for this show?

Cheers

Mike

I see points to low kicks, but thats exactly why id sooner them not be in, as the fluidity and flamboyannce it was will be most exciting, a thai giving an FC guy a pot leg isnt as exciting as an FC ko by a punch!

I would be interested in low kicks if it wasnt for the fact that it will be pretty much K1 where is the difference

I do want to open it up to all the styles, but i also want to ensure FC fighters take it up.

Conditioning is a vital part, thias would have the edge their but losing the low kick element evens it out

The concept is FC evolution styles do make fights, id also like to put hip throughs in but not pile drivers of course

scoring would cover all espects with no kick count if you dominate the round you win the round, if your being smashed up and land a great shot at the end of the round well done but over all you lost the round unless its a knock down then of course the score would differ

realtistically this will be an all the trimmings promotion with 90% of the profits going to the fighters i as the promoter will be lucky and happy with a 10% yeild. the purses and sliding scale will be transparent

sell 30+ get £150 purse £5 commission
if for an 8 man the prize fund will created from accumilated sales, less sales less pay more sales more money

this event will be around November

For that type of money you wont get the high level fighters cause its not worth fighting for.
You will end up with c or b class fighters cause they fight for £50-150 and if you want to pioneer it you need the top a class fighters to help you promote it thats why the £5000 prize fund is more viable.
More spectators will watch if you have the top fighters all fighting eachother also.
£1500 purse you can easily get for 1 x 3x3 round fight.
Why do an 8 man with 3 fights at 3 rounds with possible extra round with makes it 12 rounds for a chance to win it or nothing at all.

Your better off doing it for amatuers with a prize say week trip for 2 to spain.
That way your paying for cheap holiday couple of hundred quid which keeps promoters costs down.
Ticket sales wouldnt need to be as high.
Amatuer winner gets a prize as they cant get money purses.
Everyone happy.
Just wont be as high profile as with a class world level pros

I'd pay £50,000 a fight.. But realistically sales means money

The concept of 50 tickets minimum scared many off can't pluck money out the sky to pay fighters

Simply fighters will be paid there worth in commission the best fighter in the world is no good to me without bringing supporters, at best I'm. Not making anything as this show alone gonna cost £10,000 with out dream pay days

If fighters sell 50 tickets would be happy to pay £10 a ticket, it's simple as if you don't sell tickets how can I pay you?

How's about full contact rules, kicks above the waist with no shins/feet pads, spinning backfists allowed and wearing 6oz amateur style mma gloves. To make it diverse from K1 allow elbowing instead of the knee. 3x3 rounds. This opens it up to kickboxers who don't want to low kick and FTR fighters who are good with elbows!
Plus more exciting with the smaller glovesm

I would still like to see:

kicks above waist only
shorts
no shin or boots
5 x 3min rounds
8/10 oz gloves as per boxing

Elbows tend to make fights messy and nothing worse than having to stop a fight due to a cut or being the fighter who is fresh as a daisy but pissing blood due to adrenaline and then not being able to continue

6oz or 8oz gloves are simply damaging with not enough reward 10oz gloves and shorts ticks all the boxes

i like the sound of this where do you stand on pro and am kickboxers who can and cant compete in it?

Full contact as a concept is fine as it is (in terms of rules) - elbows/knees whatever you add its no longer full contact. Full contacts problem is its image. Moon boots and shin pads are a dated concept, i have no problem fighting without them as do i imagine most fc fighters because they are fighters.

Trousers - dont look as good as shorts. FACT! With the popularity of mma, k1 and thai moon boots and trousers look softer and less edgy - i know its the sport we love but thats how it is to the general public.

I dont know any fighters who "dont like low kicks" because they hurt. They are fighters, they get punched in the face for a laugh - a limp for a couple of week isnt the end of the world. And kicking bare shin and blocking shin to shin smashes shins anyway so might as well have low kicks in.

I love k1 and i love fc. But they are different sports. I do both but train differently for each. There are things you can do in fc that you can't in k1 and vice versa. I love boxing and you can use a wider range of boxing skills in fc than k1. But i love the different skill set required for k1 and the damage that you can do with low kicks and knees.

They are different. K1 is like a thai/kb hybrid i think bastardizing it any further with more dilution doesn't really make sense.

Why would you need to do that? Stylistically what would be the impact? Knees can limit boxing even further than low kicks if used properly so it doesn't make any sense to have low kicks out at that point. If k1 is a hybrid of styles this sound like a mongrel!!! ;)

Also - there is quite a big difference between K1 and low kick kickboxing which people don't seem to get. Clinch - even limited, catches, sweeps, knees, scoring all make a massive difference between lk kickboxing and k1. Bunging them in the same category is pretty ignorant.

Can please some of the people some of the time

Good points their Crossland lad, but K1 is K1 whether it's gone bust or what ever it's state of play is but either way a great bastardised sport regardless

Knees could mess up the bout so I think kicks above waist, no clynch or knees, spinning back fists, shorts, 10oz gloves and 3 min rounds with no kick count, kick or don't kick simply win the round by winning the round if your more aggressive with higher work rate, with most scoring shots then you win

Any one who wishes to fight low kicks then K1 is there and by all means happy to match up on the event all styles are welcome but KB-X is available

A show for fighters that is focused on paying the fighter their worth not because other promoters don't but that's what this show will be about

Any of your guys are welcome on the show Mick ;-)

No one is bunging anyone anywhere, this is a concept that offers FC purist a step up in challenge,

Pro is 3 mins no pads

There will be no amateur as am FC IS THRIVING just fine

What about the use of ringstar boots?

Interesting but the Bare foot or ankle supports just looks clean an tidy, plus have you wore the ringstars I hate them not comfy and feel restrictive in movement IMO

KB-X is the brand name as would not want to call it Pro FC as would diminish so many professional kick boxers

KB-X is simply FC rules bare foot in shorts over 3x3 or 5x3 simples

I like the sound of that much better and a move which is needed. I like the ringstar idea to encourage a wider variety of kicks but i havent worn them so cant comment. I agree no kick count but i think effective kicking should be highly rewarded especially if there is a variety of techniques - foot sweeps, spin kicks, jump & scissor kicks etc.

So is KB-X gonna contain knees then?

I don't think there's anything wrong with toying with different rules, Fight Code felt that they could change the original k1 format and it's worked, why not this with a more updated version of FC. I'd like to see knees included.

I think knees should be available but upon agreement of both fighters same as I suppose 8oz gloves if fighters want the opportunity to Taylor make it adds a bit of spice to the fold

So optional bolts on

Elbows
Knees
Low kicks

But only if both fighters agree before hand, the KB-X is the format but the option to jazz it up makes it like no other

Winning the round by accumulative reasons not just throwing in a jump spinning hook kick at the end of the round unless it connects of course

An 8 man would need to be agreed prior tho not changing each round, but with the bolt ons truly opens it up to all, but negotiations will be a headache!

The competitive streak in me sees that bouts with the extra elements will add some extra prestige to the ones who go the extra mile?

I reckon knees is a very good option with limited clinch (maybe restricted to one hand hold/one knee or one knee then release, however, i personally feel that elbows should be kept for the muay lot... Kickboxing is quite a mix of rules and confusing for a lot of people, adding bolt-ons would be unique, however, still more confusing... It would be great to see a whole show of one set of rules, all classed as pro.

The basic bare shin kickboxing idea would be best.
Make is a brand and only have one title per weight division like the ufc!
Would be exciting! That's what Stu Davies has tried with TFC.

There won't be 10 titles per division as we all already have that concept but I wouldn't like to see titles being fought for within first 12 months as with being new would sooner it evolve and gain recognition before belts are contested certainly in the 1-1 match

However I would feel sufficient to have a grand prix style belt for an 8 man plus the dream purse

But I must stress I want to be able to pay the £5000 purse but the sales from the fighters must self generate, I will invest in the show tho so this can be showcased correctly

It seems you dont know where your going with this.

Get 1 concrete rule set, not if both fighters agree causs if i knew my opponent was good with elbows i wouldnt agree same as if someone knew i was good with lowkicks they wouldnt agree.

Either keep it to full contact rules or go with k1 rules not you can knee but you cant do this or that.

By keeping K1 rules you will attract more fighters.
Full contact hasnt got many pro top level fighters now and with low winning pot you wont get many taking it up thats why you will only end up with c and b class fighters.

Equipment chance is a good idea no boots, shorts, 8oz under 70kg, 10oz gloves above.

As for tickets etc its up to the promoter to push their show and get max media attenttion and ticket sales.

If your keeping costs down and not putting the top fighters on dont expect big ticket sales.

If you make it big with top fighters on which fightfans want to see and not just fighters mates then you will get bigger ticket sales.

End of the day fighters are there to fight and promoters are there to put on and promote a show

I'm confused lol

Agree with marlon a rule set that's set in stone is a must not optional this way every1 knows where they stand

Tbh a £150 plus a £5 ticket deal is a c class purse, its not worth the risk of training for 8-10 weeks for 300 when u may suffer injury first fight and get no further

Interesting concept I like the idea re branding etc, but before A class fighters get involved I think it may have to grow a bit, not trying to pull it to pieces at all as I do like it

Well guys you see exactly what my thinking is,

the direction i am going is purely FC rules above the waist in 10oz gloves and shorts over 3 minute distance pure evolution.

to give options would just be a mine field as a promoter this would pretty much be my mind set, KB-X show case if fighters want to fight K1 i will match same as traditional FC or Thai thats what a promoter does.

I have vast experience of promoting i have had radio coverage, flyers, posters, 10's of thousands of flyers sent in post, models handing flyers out and many other forms and do you know what does sweet FA, did it for 4 shows at great expense and averaged a crowd of 250!!!!.

I then put a boxing laden show fek all advertising other than posters, and crowd was 1000!!!!! was it a fluke was it ballax it was the boxers they understand that they need to sell tickets so they sell its as simple as that

I as the promoter am like the event coordinator i pull it all together, this is shy i believe the fighters are paid their worth

Pro boxing sell 80 tickets or your a journey man and even then there is no guarentee, martial artist are shy humble people well they need to turn into sales people if they want recognition

NO sales NO money Marlon iv watched you from the beginning and have respect and a lot of time for you, But cold hard truth is if you dont sell yourself and bring supporters then you a liability to my bank manager awsome fighter to put on any bill, but although im not fussed about making money i have less interest in losing it ;-)

I have tyoed this seperate as belive it a vital point....

The politics in FC are tarred with one thing or another between orgs.

this will be the most significant thing about KB-X it will be a stand alone brand from all orgs it will be insured under its own right.

what does this mean, well there is no ties to any one org so open to all it will be run by a group of individuals for its sole growth and nurture

This will be clean and pure Full Contact has been looking for a revamp here it is "KB-X" it does not need any gimics FC is a stand alone sport by its own merrits KB-X will see all FC fighters at their most dangerous without the politics and shite

Titles will contested but their will be 1 Area champion, 1 English champion and 1 British champion etc for each division.

The validity of titles for FC is ? as there are so many orgs theirs probably 10 different middleweight world champions in the midlands let alone the world

right now there is not 1 KB-X champion which is the most esciting part your either the best or number 2, 1 style 1 champion who wants to be undisputed Number 1 because thats what KB-X offers ;-)

Also regarding sales

I only print 100 posters for boxing shows and just them the fighters, and average 300-500 a show, 99% of spectatators are direct supporters of a fighter

The 1% that come on door when asked did they see a poster they say no iv come to see my mate who's fighting he told me about it

So I put a show on with 6 bouts on and the boxers each sell between 40-100 tickets so tell me how can a kick boxer expect to be paid anything without supplementing the show?

Boxing has always had better attendance that's why Kickboxing shows now put boxing on to help with ticket sales.

Kickboxing has always been a local thing with local guys fighting each other for free, local title fights v foreign opponents as long as the fighter does ticket sales to cover opponents costs, or fights for deducted purse or sometimes even no purse just to get title shot.

Then when you want to defend no one wants to pay defence purses and just fights for another or vacant title.

Not digging mate Ive put massive shows on myself under WAKO ISKA WKA etc just saying if you want to start a new concept and want the top fighters unfortunatally you have to pay for it.
I'd personally go big (with an 8 man and rest of the show with local b-c class fighters to keep costs down but still have 12 bouts)to set the benchmark and get more top guys and girls interested for next one.

Fighters will always sell tickets from there area, but promoter should always be pushing the show.

Fighters should concentrate on fighting not being a tout. lol

Maybe you should do some b-c class shows 1st to keep costs down then when you have more in the pot you can go bigger.

You do need that rule set 1st before asking fighters to fight cause 1st thing they will ask is what are the rules, whats purse or winning pot for 8 man and what equipment do you wear :)

I hear ya but on the first boxing laden show I did the one who sold most was actually a kick boxer on his 1st fight

It's not boxing or kickboxing it's the fighter selling them selves

Not digging Marlon but reads above as tho put local fighters on who will sell 40 tickets a piece and fight for free so as a big name can be paid a large purse and not bring support

Big name or novice sales are a necessity for all involved to which all should be awarded accordingly

FigHters really need to try to shift tickets as it's part of the business they're in, unfortunately. Nobody can enter a sport knowing the popularity levels and expect thousands to fight, it's just not realistic in the UK as almost zero TV interest, so almost zero decent sponsorship.

I think as stated above, the full contact rules in bare shins/shorts could really elevate full contact to higher levels for pro's. We're all aware of k1 and the Fight Code version, but full contact/KB-X is still a great format and would be quite exciting. Visually I think it would be appealing to fans also because it would be fast and clean to watch.

Hit the nail on the head there actionpromos, it has to gain recognition from with in from self generated sales, i as the promoter am shelling out £10,000 to put the show on salea are necessary to cover all costs, and all will be rewarded upon their sales supporters build the sport regardless of the art, the fighter is the best form of promotion through word of mouth

trust me i go to some shows where the fighter is absolute garbage but they sell 200 tickets baffles me as they are embaressing but they still sell big numbers, its not impossible but its a necessity as joe public not interested,has to supporters with an investested interest ie they know the fighter in one way or another

What about if you did a boxing under card seeing you get 1000 spectators then have your kbx 8 man as the main event.
2 men as reserve if they are not needed they can fight each other so that makes 10 men at 30 tickets each at £ 20 with a £5000 winners pot giving you £ 1000 extra for the possible reserve bout.
No cost to you to get the Kbx brand up and running.
I you do that ill be interested :)

I'm happy to do that with a £3000 prize reflective of 30 tickets sold or £5000 on 50 tickets sold, being pro fighters should have a professional attitude to the business side which is sales

So basically all fighters are on £10 a ticket commission either way for the 8 man so

60k
65k
70k
75k
80k
85k

Who should the 8 men be out of the above divisions?

Bates / Tate / Hunt would be a great addition if viable.

Think Tate is tied up with show time, but I'd gladly put those guys on who else is out there in other styles that may be interested ?

Think Tate is tied up with show time, but I'd gladly put those guys on who else is out there in other styles that may be interested ? In that division

Why not just have one title for the whole category e.g. world title over area British European etc. Showtime do it and it looks more prestigious I think

It's a rule set in relation bare foot FC but tiered titles will show the transition and level of Area level to World level as without growth and structure would be a flash in the pan

With a reputable structure would ensure integrity the eight mans would be presented with a grandpix quality belt

Not read it all but agree with Marlon that you might aswell have low kick in there and have it K1... it is back in popularity again.

Otherwise if you want to try and move kickboxing to become more modern then maybe the trousers without shin and instep, no knees, but spin back fists and 3 x 2 for the explosiveness that will entertain the public or 3 x 3 which suits fights more.

I may be up for this depending on weight and date

Whitti by not reading it you have actually come to the same conclusion of how it was actually intended to be

FC rules kicks above the waist
No knees or elbows
No low kicks
No clinch
No kick count
No politics
No foot and shin
10oz gloves
Shorts not trousers
Spinning backs
Sweeps and hip throws allowed
3x3 or 5x3 for titles

All purses will be commission led @ £10 ticket if sell £30 or more

How about this both fighters sell 30 each which would generate £600 commission why not winner get £400 loser gets £200, so basically winner would 2 3rds and loser would get 1 3rd. But on like for like sales do to be fair if one sold 30 and the other 50 the pot split would go to the average of 30, and the 20 extra would automatically go to the one who sold them so

Fighter A sells 30 = £300
Fighter B sells 50 = £500
Average would be £600 with £200 automatically going to B

So if fighter B won he would get 2 3rds of the pot £400 + £200 extra = £600 loser gets £200 if a draw pot split 50/50 except for the extra sold that's on a 1-1 fight

8 man tho would also be built of the average of the minimum of 30 sold, which would be 8x£300 = £2400 winner would get £2000 2nd £500 all who took part £300

With me as the promoter not making a profit on the 8 man as promoter left with about £2000 towards a £10,000 show to which yes the boxing undercard will hopefully mean break even if lucky!

This is all based on minimum of 30 some may sell more or less than 30 by selling less you forfit the claim to the big pot it's a minimum requirement so why should any not be required to meet it?

That wont please all as some want the £5000 prize fund the only way that will happen is if they sell 50 each above is simply a business plan

If no one is interested in the 8 man then that's cool

KB-X is pretty much my baby so I will put on a show and any one who wishes to fight under the KB-X style will be welcome to and will be matched accordingly if there are no takers its not the end of the world ;-)

So you saying fighters will just be fighting for their own tickets sold?

2 fighters 30 tickets each is 60 x £30= £1800 - £10 commission each = £300 each ticket commission.

60 tickets sold x £20= £1200 total.

Out of that £1200 you would give the winner £400 and loser £200?
Making you £600 profit per fight

With the 8 man Ticket Commission £300 each.
They generate 8 x 30 tickets x £20= £4800 total.
Of that £4800 you will give winner £2000 and runner up £500
Making you £2300 profit for the 8 man

Good profit for you with no work put in and fighters are just fighting for their own tickets sold.

You would have to up the winning pot cause you need the top fighters to help you start your brand and again the top fighters get paid a lot more than that in singular bouts.

As for the hip throw allowed wouldn't that mean you would have to clinch your opponent to throw them, yet you can't clinch?

Again I'm not digging the concept is very interesting. Its heading in the right direction and I like I know a few other top fighters would definitely be interested, you just really for 1 need to get the rules set in stone

Personally the K1 Rules are great and everyone knows them meaning nothing new to learn or adapt to

As its FC only I would just keep the Full Contact Rules we have now but :

Have no kick count but Kicks must be thrown with power and intent.
Score : Combinations and Continuous Kicking, so punches with kicks on the end or Kicks with punches followed up to keep fight flowing.
Aggressiveness/Forward fighting/Ring Control
Good Defence and Balance
Counter Punching/Kicking
Power punches and Kicks
Deduct for Running Away/Time wasting/Not fighting
Flicky kicks which a lot of fighters do just to get their kicks in or look busy.

3x3 min rounds for all fights even 8 man final unless a draw then extra round
5x3 min for title fights and again extra round if draw.
There must be a winner!

1 show title per weight cat (KB-X Show Champion)
1 show title per cat for 8 man (KB-X GP Show Champion)
You win both you are the def Champion.
Champions will get more fights as there is a chance to defend the KB-X Show Title with the GP Title up for grabs say 2x per year.

And No2 Unfortunately you would need a decent winning pot to attract the top fighters.

The top fighters don't just go to the gym 2x per week for 1hr as a hobby. lol

With the top fighters you have to take into account management fees, travel fees for training camps, sparring etc time off work either due to training or injuries after fight which means loss of funds.

By the time you get you winning pots for a single bout + commission £700 or for the 8 man £2300 - all the expenses its not worth the top level fighter doing it.

To get your brand up and running like any other business you have to put the money into it to make it work.
You cant run a new concept on a shoe string or in your case nothing as the fighters have to generate their own purses and winning pots and expect all the top guys and girls to fight for pennies.

Marlon, to be fair not read all you have put as at the start your figures are wrong

Tickets £25 - £10 comm equals £15 left over this was in relation to the 8 man as if a fighter only sells 30 tickets then he is in for the big pot

The 2rds was for 1-1 fight the winner gets the larger of the purse

Flat out I'm only putting a minimum of 30 tickets pro boxing is 80 minimum to get a £900 purse on home shows due to rest if money has to pay the bills, I'm pretty sure the rest you wrote was correct although I haven't read it, but ok I'm happy to put tickets at £30 and pay £15 com which would be

£450 per fighter which would give a £3600 purse but aren't £30 tickets steep ?

Sorry Marlon you must not have read what I put

Winner £2000
Runner up £500
The 6 losers each get £300 = £1800
= £4300
30 tickets x £10 = £300 each x 8 men = £2400 so I'm actually putting in the missing £1900

So as promoter in left with £3600 - £1900 = £1700 to put a £10,000 show on I must be fekkin mad, read above again and you see how greedy I am lol

My figures are pretty viable.

£ 30 a ticket (most shows are that anyway)
£ 20 for promoter (Again that's what most promoters take)
£ 10 ticket commission for fighter (Fighter has the choice to sell at £ 20 to guarantee 30 ticket sales for promoter, or sell for more £ 25 or £ 30 to make a bit extra in case they don't win fight or 8 man.)

Promoter just needs to sort decent purse and 8 man pot :)

Mate read what I have put I'm happy to do the tickets at £30 with £15 com going to the pot my figures were on £25 a ticket at £10 com read my figures I'm out of pocket in relation to costs of a show

21st July 2012 at the metrodome either 8 man or 1-1 send me your details if want to fight KB-X rules

This show is already going ahead as a boxing event but happy to match any one up

Tell ya what as first one ever

Bates v Hunt
3x3 tickets are £30 ticket com will be £20 per ticket sold if both available can't grumble at that ? ;-)

I'm only saying these two as they have shown interest and would be an excellent first KB-X bout

I've had 3 top fights offered that week and had to turn them down, I'm in Bulgaria, marlons fighting petrescu sometime around then too I think

Yeah on the 15 th

No problem is there any other fighters out there that would want to fight for £20 per ticket on commission 21st July ?

Lol no one wants to fight for £20 ticket commission probably sounded too good to be true but was a genuine offer

Back on poin as this has gone purely money minded

This is about KB-X rules format our November show will feature this style and brand fighters will be paid accordingly ;-)

Let me know closer to the time john, might be available then :)

No problem won't be £20 com tho this was a one off this was only due to this show being full steam ahead, every show is your last as a promoter ;-)

I'll fight for £20 a ticket - but I can't do head contact anymore. Is this a problem?

Im sure if both camps agree to no head contact you can lol.
Only messing :)

Let me know nearer the time for the Nov one as well John

No headshots KB-LX ... Kickboxing LessExtreme!

Lol Carl your better half would hunt me down if I allowed you to fight x

If any fighters took this offer they would have been the poster boys for KB-X

Some may say guinea pigs but I think poster boys sounds better ;-)

I am Definately interested in putting a show on for KB-X in November is there Definately an interest from the FC guys to step it up a notch?

id fight if it was k1 or thai 80-85kg 8 man tournemant.. my number 07590200516 Joe Mcgovan

Hi Joe,

you are always welcome on our show's under which ever rules you like, the show will be a a general show with a focus on KB-X but will feature all other styles if i can accomodate a particular match up

dragonfoot
Posted: 2012-06-16 08:29:15
Think Tate is tied up with show time, but I'd gladly put those guys on who else is out there in other styles that may be interested ?

Hi mate...Tate is bound but we can match him as well in the months in between which we are looking for :-)

Hi buddy storm gym always welcome

Heres what I propose

Tate
Hunt
Bates

Plus 5 others ticket deal of £15 per ticket will go into a prize pot min 30 tickets each £3000 to winner £500 to runner up or minimum 50 tickets each £5000 winner £1000 to runner up £300 to all who take part

If all sold 50 tickets would gives me £6000 to put a £10,000 show on

So who thinks they could sell 50 tickets to be in running for £5,000 winners purse

KB-X rules who IS! up to challenge!!!!

If you guys want it for november I will put it on????

Would be awesome to get those three on.

Plus I reckon Gareth Richards would be up for it also so 4 top FC guys wouldnt it be nice if their were 4 top Thais at this division up for it... Who is there and who would win thai or FC

out of the 4 guys mentioned Richards is the strongest iv seen but he is the one iv seen fight most recent ok he couldn't Stop the Law but neither as any one else

If not thai is there 4 other FC fighters that weight who could be a contender?

James Watling is after fights, unsure if he'd do the rules but he's in awesome condition at the minute and is a good hitter.

As I said before make it K1 Rules style criteria and Thaiboxers and K1 Rules fighters would also be interested.

Gareth Richards strong guy ad good edition.
Supposed to of fought him until the promoter offered me a massive purse of £300 and no travel expenses for me or my coaches, meaning Id have to pay for the return flights from Amsterdam for my coaches, and 1 twin hotel room for 1 night for me and 2 coaches, meaning I'd also have to pay for another night and another twin room for 2 nights.
The promoter also only offered Gareth a ticket deal with no purse for the fight.

Us as fighters are not a charity. Lol

Get Joe McGovern in there also. Great guy :)
Lyndon Knowels
Valentino Petrescu
Shame Christian Di Paolo is retired that would be an awesome 8 man
Sahak Hak( Supposed to of fought him 3 yrs ago in Holland, but they pulled and never gave the rematch and now he is Its Showtime World Champion. lol

Vanni Fae (ITA)
Ghanem Channeh (FRA)
Alex Skiba (GER)

All strong Technical Fighters

Then again if we all get -80kg we could get Artem Levin in there.

That all said winning purse would have to be a hell of a lot more, so this is probably more a dreamlist instead of it actually happening

Marlon, i may be wrong but i think the KB-X version is with the aim of elevating full contact rules to a more professional status as opposed to just creating a hybrid style. Well, that's the opinion i formed.

Full contact at the minute is suffering a lot and needs new input to give the pro scene a modern makeover. I am interested to see how this develops as i'd be willing to embrace it next year when i resume activities (this year concentrating on my business so no time to promote)

sounds good...

Let's go tag team

Brand new concept

Team strips, merchandise, leagues the marketing is endless

:)

MMA already tried this. Massive failure ha. Then again they also tried some crap MMA-type-ballgame. Says it all really.

Action promos I agree with where fc should be heading but john said he would like 4 thai boxers and end of the day they won't fight just fc rules that's why knees and low kicks would get more interest off the thai and k1 community.

As for the tag thing they did that with wcl ran by chuck norris in america.

Ran its course as mma just took over.
Was a good concept though
Oval kumite shaped bowl ring, no ropes or cage and low kicks allowed.
Single matches and team matches with point scoring system like football.
3 points for win 1 for draw 0 for loss
You then got a winning team and overall single competitor winner.

I was only joking of course lol I hope No1 has actually thought let's try it,

Thais won't compete in this, not without leg kicks its still not the middle ground like K1

World Combat League was an exciting format.

I admit, k1 is the ultimate 'in-between' format to get the best of most styles battling each other, though again if you look at it from a full contact perspective it is a good way to elevate the pro ranks and modernise it.

you got mail!!!!

Cheers Amir

So to confirm Tate with the backing of storm gym is up for this 8 man

The suggestion for Thais would the possibility of the fight purse, surely they can still cause damage with kicks to the head and body licks a kick a punch is a punch at this level can't see someone being stopped by a pot leg or even be an exciting aspect out cold on their back is the aim

This is going to be a show with 50% of the money in going to the prize pot

The other weight divisions have been quiet so my focus is in this division

Tate
Richards
Hunt
Bates

Putting international fighters would water the pot down as they won't be fetching supporters but Definately scope for growth to do it as England v Europe

4 English fighters
Matched at random against
4 Europeans

Then winners fight off to final 2 that would be Major Definately interested in that for future concept but let's cement British version before inviting European in

So come on guys are the other 3 of the 4 up for this then we can look at finding the dark horses for this clash

You got all 4 of them to agree???? Awsome. This could be very interesting, let's hope everyone's fit and at their best as it could cement them as the number 1 in the division.

No only Tate has confirmed onboard if other 3 are willing to commit
Bates
Hunt
Do you want in?

I will contact Richards camp if these four confirm I will book the venue and set the date and source out 6 others first 4 will be the 8 man last 2 will be reserve

You've got my interest that's for sure, but youl have to speak to the boss, who I doubt ull get a hold of till Monday, he's hard enough to get in touch with on your average day but our shows this weekend so good luck lol

Tate vs Bates.... Sure I'll buy a ticket for that alone.

Get your rules sorted then get in contact John so I can put it forward to my management.

No point agreeing to something if you don't know 100% what rules etc are going to be yourself :)

The rules are set im only interested in evolving FC so rules will be FC rules modified equipment and round change

Shorts not trousers
10oz gloves
No foot or shin
Spin back fist allowed
3x3 min rounds
No kick count
Kicks and punches score the same
Blocked shots don't score
To win land the most shots or stoppage

Iv no interest in competing with the K1 style that style is fine it's only problem is K1 is a brand name

FC has been stuck in a rut and in my opinion kick counter at pro level was the last nail in the coffin

KB-X has arrived the gladiators above will be the pioneers and history is in the making

Richards camp have been informed interested but due to holidays will be discussed an confirmed on return

Tate, Bates, Richards all geared up Hunt it's your call ;-)

Was I not the 1st one to say I was interested? lol
Mail me all info :)

Can't see he point whatsoever in blocked shots being scored, ridiculous.

KBX got my vote, very interested myself in the idea. Copyright permitting!! :)

Just checking ;-)

I have been thinking of the concept for last over 12 months was going to be X-FC extreme full contact but but my mate Mr Davies launched TFC kind of pipped me to the post in some respect

So went back to the drawing board, FC is and always be stand alone rules system but for one reason or another it's stuck, quality fighters are still progressing and achieving none the less but I feel this boost truly offers the elite the next step

KB-X is the next step for the purist FC fighter

Best of luck with it. I was chatting to the wkf earlier today and they are really interested also to see how it developes and said would offer any assistance they could, if needed/wanted.

Thanks much appreciated

Input is welcome from all parties, the essential part of KB-X is that it is stand alone as a brand and rule set,

To be a great success will require all orgs getting behind it as the fighters are nested in the orgs,

But not to have WWWWKIA KB-X world champion KB-X will only have its champions won't make money that way but there will only be 1 champion per division not multiple champions of same division

The fights can by all means happen on other shows hosted by a variety of orgs but KB-X stands alone in influenced but open to all

I would like to host 3 shows a year dedicated to 8 mans covering different weight divisions

KB-X Grand Prix's

But let's sort the first one first ;-)

Get on with it then and mail full details. lol

I'm on with it lots to sort out but the bones of it are there ;-)

Thinking ahead a little here but are the titles all gonna be tourneys, or will there be challenge belts too?

What's your email, I don't want to. Hammer this thread with my queries ha

Oops, on ya profile. Got it. Will email soon as in front of pc, takes ages on this iPad malarkey.

Titles for Grand Prix's will be separate from national titles
Grand Prix's 3x3
National titles 5x3

But there will only be 1 National title per division so no easy route or dodging if an agreed match cannot be made in a 12 month time frame, for arguments sake challenger makes a reasonable challenge and champion arses around for unjustified reason then will be given chance to explain, if not justifiable then will be stripped

Arguments over purses will happen so

British title £750 pot 2/3rds to winner 1/3rd to loser

European title £1000 pot 2/3rds to winner 1/3rd to loser

World title £1500 pot 2/3rds to winner 1/3rd to loser

In respect of titles that's the minimum of what should be offered if turned down as not enough then people have to get real can't pluck money out of the sky unless a major sponsor is involved then offers can increase above is the minimum

But as promoter for world title both fighters would be required to sell 50 tickets each which yes is £3000 but - £1500 purse - £500 for top range belt leaves £1000 towards cost of a show, which ether way you moan £20 out of every ticket goes to purse and belt the pot could of course be split 50/50 but that would have to be agreed upon, but arguing over pot will not be accepted as the minimum 2/3rds would be enforced

I won't faff about as arguments over money etc is why there is 100 world champions of one division I won't be making 200, if fighters don't like that tough shit they can carry in being 99 out of 100 world champions the KB-X World champion will be that "WORLD CHAMPION" to know your the only 1 is priceless alone

If you don't like it your part of the problem not the solution in my opinion ;-)

Just do a Show title and GP title

Given it some thought at present feel as though KB-X GP champion is the way forwards but will also look at standard fights of 3x3 other titles are not really needed at moment as plenty of titles around at moment

Which would allow KB-X to evolve

Keep it simple to start with Jon.

If KBX is a tournament, then keep it so, just have a belt for the winner and that will be great.

Why have world titles? You don't have area titles. If epople want to fight under the rule set then they will and it will grow but at the moment its a mini tournament. Lets see what happens.

My thoughts exactly Mark it's in it's infancy but what a starting block if the four guys above pioneer it what would be great if some top fighters from lighter and heavier divisions came into it at say 82.5k as the middle do fighters below 80k and over 85k could adjust to fit in so 4 divisions I'd like to set would be

62.5k
72.5k
82.5k
92.5k

Marlon recon ya could get to 62.5k now that's a challenge ;-)

Why worry about weights now. just pick the weight were you can get the best guys for this show and then think about the divisions further donw the road.

You know me love a challenge lol.

Firmly set on the division above but dont want the other guys to feel left out

Still need 4 others plus 2 reserve any wild cards out there ?

What date is this happening again, can't find it. Might make the trip for it.

Oh well this particular division has been scuppered so change of scope

8 mans are a nightmare especially at this level as to find a stand in not gonna happen

I sourced £2000 sponsorship so the pot would have been guarenteed £5000 on 30 tickets sold

So not doing this as an 8 man

If people want to fight under KB-X rules then I will simply put a show on mid October to early November

Standard ticket price will be £25

Under 30 sold £5 commission
Over 40 sold £10 commission
Over 50 sold £15 commission

Is anyone interested in the show and fighting under these rules comment on here or email jondgreen@hotmail.com

End of July is the cut off if there is interest I will put it on if not I won't

KB-X won't be jumpers for goal posts it will be the real deal! ;-)

Jon.

Most fighters these days in full contact dont weigh that heavey. By setting that weight division 75-78k fighters wont go up that high.

Better off at about 66k ish. Lot more fighters at that weight, some of who have never been close to decent payday and also who can sell tickets. Or, 72k, classic K1 weight. Lots again and I could real them off for you.

Weight divs of 62, 66, 72, 78k make a lot of sense, at 82 there are only the 3 guys you mentioned really. Or maybe even a super heavy open class and let who them just come in with no weigh in?

You would not need to set the money so high then.

Makes sense that Mark weights above we're to speculate

But think the 80+ division fekkd

I think a good concept as its a grand prix actually havIng a points system where many can be matched up in 1-1 fights and for arguments sake 10 points for a win 5 points for fighting

From a points league top 2 of each division fight at end of year for number 1 slot points system would be a self ranking system also

I'm all ears for any division that's got activist fighters

2 years 2 8 mans and both have been wrecked by another promoter more the fool me I suppose

An event where lions share of the pot could go to the fighter

If went national with a league fight off would actually be a grand prix


Mark also going to be looking for Pro Boxers if any of your guys want to have a crack Shaun Laws 1st pro fight scheduled for September

Mean many as in if goes national on various events

Activity = points

Activity + points = ranking

Activity + points + ranking = recognition

I'm looking at how it could grow but initially do any FC FIGHTERS want to fight under these rules

As the Thais can't take the piss for moon boots any more ;-)

Chris James will be up for it 78k winner of 8 man in Weston-S-Mare, under the radar at the moment but threatening bigger things. ALL OR NOTHING camp, Bridgwater

Cool all are welcome

If I run an 8 man will call it a Grand Slam not grand prix

KB-X Grand Slam series

Will be from ground up really all comers welcome I'm aiming to give fighters £750 for a basic 3x3 fight can't grumble at that?

Hey Bro! can I come fight?

Hi dave, thought you'd retired buddy, but be great to have you over