Just wondering if anyone knows when the first female Thai boxing fight was in the UK? and who it was between... Also when did Thai boxing arrive in the UK? Cheers!

Hi James

The frist Ladies Thai boxing fight was in 1979. Anne Quinlan v Juile Kershaw

Very funny to watch but three knock downs!! and a very bad decsion too! Have been trying to up load it but not having much luck. I have a fight that is not listed on my record in fact most of the fights i had are not listed!!!

Respect Anne.

Hi Paul

Whats this i hear about a teachers x fighters show!!!!

Lucia Rijker class act and sexy as fook too x

Cheers Anne for your help!

Is this video of the 1979 fight or a different one? (names different on video)

Hey Anne... are you are sooooo old that you used to fight in black and white :) x

Hi James

No the vid is from a later fight. Early 80s. I do have it on tape but its so funny to watch.

Hi Vinny, you are quite right she is sweet. However she was much bigger than me. I was 46kg and was taking on weight for most of my fights as it was. I have a great respect her and would have loved too been bigger.

Dave you noticed!! Well they had only just invented VHS I THINK!!

Would love to see this video of your fight with Juile Kershaw. I have an exhibition coming up; I'll be displaying photographs I took at the Ladykillers show last February. I'm hoping to include a projection piece, so this would be great if I could see your video & maybe include it.

If you'd like to come to the exhibitions let me know.

Would love to see this video of your fight with Juile Kershaw. I have an exhibition coming up; I'll be displaying photographs I took at the Ladykillers show last February. I'm hoping to include a projection piece, so this would be great if I could see your video & maybe include it.

If you'd like to come to the exhibitions let me know.

don't know what happened there....

where was your fight held against Julie in 1979?

Thanks!

Hi James i would love to come along thanks.

It took place in oldham at a local night spot, Master Toddy promotion. I was fighting out of master woodys camp!!! The fight was judged a draw, but i think you would agree it was the wrong result. I do have the fight on d.v.d but not quite sure why it will not up load to you tube. some of my other fight are there.

Thanks for the info Anne.

It would be great to show your first fight at the exhibition, especially as the place will be busy and I'm trying to invite as many people as possible involved in Muay Thai. Maybe it would be possible to get hold of a copy of your DVD?

My email address is jamespogson@gmail.com if you send me an email I'll send you info on the exhibitions - held this june.

Cheers Anne

Thanks for the info Anne.

It would be great to show your first fight at the exhibition, especially as the place will be busy and I'm trying to invite as many people as possible involved in Muay Thai. Maybe it would be possible to get hold of a copy of your DVD?

My email address is jamespogson@gmail.com if you send me an email I'll send you info on the exhibitions - held this june.

Cheers Anne

OK I WILL DO MY BEST TO UP LOAD IT. IF IT WONT GO THEN WE WILL HAVE TO TRY A DIFFERENT OPTION! BEST WISHES ANNE LEK

Anne,

Teachers fighting! so long as i dont have to fight you!

Anne, Its a shame really that the young girls of today don't know you.

Your fight footage would be a massive inspiration to them.

Met Lucia last week she was very very nice,she is in the new star trek movie i wanted to do commentary with her but she was with RTL shame i just wanted stare at her and because she is so sexy...lol don,t tell her lol x

Hi vinny, She is class and I will look out for her in star trek.

Well Dave what can I say, I am getting along to shows and hope to raise my profile in the comming year by supporting young fighters. Have been told that i look very sharp and who knows could be digging up my old kit for teachers show!!!!!

Thats great Anne. I put my name down for that too but I hope they don`t make me fight you :)

Great news Anne! (as Dave already said)

You know, I have sevral of your old bouts on vhs. I am going to buy a machine soon that at least *purports* to "upgrade" the quality of old VHS tapes and then convert them onto DVDs.

When I get it, Ill let you know. I remember a long time ago i promised to send those to you, then my vcr broke, and then to make matters even worse, I lost your postal address.

I have the tape somewhere of that fight done on a TV documentary (first womens world title fight done on tv i think) in which you KO'd the Dutch Champion, I forget her name. (the tall blond) I think you fought her 3 times?

btw, my email is womenkickboxing at yahoo.com lets do an interview!


Regards,

dan

Now I remember, Anne...it was Yolanda Mol you fought on TV for a title. maybe the first womens title fight evebroadcast on tv?? (at least in the western hemisphere.)

..what year was that TV documentary which included your title fight with Yolanda?

Network 7

Hi Dan, dont think network 7 was the first LADIES fight to be shown, if i remmember rightly lisa fought a thai, 1985 or something close to that. I am not quite sure of the date never got a trophy for that fight!!!!! I will find out and post later.

Hi Dan, dont think network 7 was the first LADIES fight to be shown, if i remmember rightly lisa fought a thai, 1985 or something close to that. I am not quite sure of the date never got a trophy for that fight!!!!! I will find out and post later.

Anne has been a massive inspiration to me, I have has the priveledge of seeing her train and occasionally sparring with her at Master A's, and she is amazing, her hand speed is like nothing I have ever come across in a fight and her composure is better than that of most fighters (male and female) that I have had the pleasure of training with. Anne is a real inspiration to me.
Rachael Jones

I would take a guess at 1989/90 for the network 7 show
I started training in 1990 and it was fresh in peoples memory then. Network 7 also screened a piece on Thai women fighters in Thailand around that time.
The first female fight I saw on video was Anne Quinlan V Apple from Thailand. It was full thai rules and 5x3min (in 1990?) The first live female fight I saw was Anne v Nong Lek from Thailand, Anne won by head kick knockout in round 1.
Anne set quite a benchmark.

Angel, I have a vhs tape of two womens KB fights from japan dated in the early 80's, but they were not televised, and they were in the Orient-not the west.

the 2 fights were: Britt Van Buskirk vs Kaorou Jumbo, and Reiko Tachibana vs
one of Lilly Rodriguez' fighters. I forgot her name, but you can see Lilly cornering this woman.

I also have sme early Anne Holmes, Anne Quinlan, Ella Yee and Lisa Howarth tapes in vhs format that I would really like to date, so I can record the results for posterity on our womens fight results archives: www.womenkickboxing.com/results.htm


Its a fascinating topic. Who really knows when the first two women anywhere in the world, actually put on the gloves-or perhaps even fought bare knuckle??

I do know that in the UK, a few years back, there is a strong "unlicensed game" where women fought in small gatherings with a small coterie of afficionados, volunteer "refs" etc. I have in the past corresponded with a lady in the UK who boxed in these unsanctioned fights.

These fights are of course illegal for very good reasons. But, their continued existence, which dates back quite a while, makes me wonder just when women first fought-seeing as how 100 years ago it was absolutely forbidden by law in the West.

Even today, in the year 2008, ridiculous superstitions keep women out of Lumpinini.

But what about in antiquity, like say hundreds of years ago in the orient?
It would be great to discover some drawings, wrtings, or ancient manuscripts or even paintings.

Its hard to belive womens figting just suddenly happened in the late 60's or 70's.

Dan,

Do you have anymore information on these unlicensed fights? What type of fighting, why was it happening and through what years?
Also does Thai Kickboxing have more female fighters in the west, rather than in Thailand - I don't know about the current restrictions for female fighters in Thailand.
Do you know how womens fighting became sanctioned in the 60s/70s?

All this info is much appreciated, Cheers

Thai Lady fighters have been around for a very long time. I trained at sityotong in 1980 and came accross a number of very good fighters. They were not allowed to enter the ring or train at the same time as the male boxers!! I was however due to fact my sponsor owened the camp. Before taking up Muay Thai I mixed with the kickboxing scene, such people as Danny Connor, Lance Lewis. Knowone ever mentioned they knew of any under ground fights untill the network 7 event. I do know that there was something going on in london around the late 80s, "amazon girl fights, very dodgy," i was given some coverage and went mad about being featured in it. I was the only one to have a kit on!!!!! P.S I DID NOT KEEP A COPY

Well it could be a good time to ask if anyones got old vidoes or photos from my past fights. These are fights that may not have been put on record since they were very early on in my career.


Anne Quinlan v G legget from Dublin, I never got to see the video!! I won but there was a 10kg weight difference and during round 4 I complained about the ref being over ruff with my arm, he almost snapped my elbow!!!! The venue was PORT MADDOCK in Dublin.

Anne Quinlan V fighter from Master Sken, Inter club event at master woodys club in oldham. I won 5 secounds in the first round.


Anne Quinlan V G Blackwell, FOUGHT HER TWICE, Bolton and London WON BOTH FIGHTS. Once again a fight that I never got to see the video if there was one.


Anne Quinlan V E Rooijakers Duch fighter, London 1987 I won on points

Anne Quinlan V french champion v lalour not sure of spelling. Won round one, 10 secounds.

A few pics to jog the memory!!!!

A few pics to jog the memory!!!!

A few pics to jog the memory!!!!

A few pics to jog the memory!!!!

A few pics to jog the memory!!!!

Wow they are lager than life!!! Check out Master Kevin, and a very slim master woody!! Ha Ha

Rachael Jones you are top, cant wait to see you in action once again. Are you planning any fights soon? I know Master A's got a show COMMING UP.

Anne, these photos are great - how many of these do you have?

It could be interesting to make an archive of all your photographs and recorded fights.

I think an archive of all the fighters from the start of thai kickboxing in the uk would be something quite different. It would be inspiring for all the current trainees of the sport and would educate people who don't know about thai kickboxing and shed some optimistic light, rather than having documentaries such as baby fight club representing the sport to the general public.

Anne, is the french fighter veronique lelouier? (fought on the same bill as howarth v florence suire. oldham) If so its available to buy at various websites. Its called Thai boxing superfights.

One of my trainers went to Sityodtong in 1988, he was looking around for a phone and wandered into a building that used to be the womens quarters, it was deserted and dusty but still had pictures of women fighters on the wall. I wonder why they went.

Dan, that's interesting about Brit van Buskirk. I didn't know she had a thai/kick boxing background, at age 40 she proved quite a handful for Rijker in a boxing match and beat Sumya Anani.
What are the names of both contestants in the fights you're trying to date?

excellent pictures.

Great pictures Anne thanks for the memories,especially the one of a very young looking Master Woody,pulled at my heart strings that one,thanks again Anne.

Angel, Britt has no KB or MT training to my knowledge.

she ko'd Japanese kickboxer and wrestler, Jumbo Kaoru in the first rd.
(using her boxing techniques only.)

to be fair, Britt was young then, and at 5'10' inches tall she towered over the 5' tall very short armed Jumbo, who was totally overwhelmed.

As for her fight with Rijker, Britt had been in retirement for
ten years when Rijker called and challenged her.

Britt had about two weeks to get rid of 10 years of ring rust
before fighting the best female boxer active at that time.

Extenuating circumstances: Rijker's original opponent had cancelled on her last minute, ( two weeks before scheduled fight)..and Britt was chosen as a substitute because she had announced she was going to make a comeback.

(some opponent for a comeback-Lucia Rijker)

as you know, rijker TKO'd britt in (I think) the 5th rd or possibly the 6th...I'll have to watch the tape again-i havent watched female boxing in several years-since I have devoted my website to female kickboxing and MT only-two sports which are far superior to the female side of western boxing-imho

RE dating fights: I have about 30-40 very old fights on VHS for which I need dates and venues. many of them are rijker's old fights.

some are of Lisa Howarth (her fight with Zelda Tekin in particular)
some are of Ella Yee, some are of Anne Quinlan, some are of Melita Carnavas,
some of Ramona Gatto,(such as Caranavs vs Gatto) and so on...


@ James 23:

The lady I corresponded with was someone I traded female fight tapes with.

I "met" or i should say got her email addie through Sue Fox's womens boxing website which used to have a bulletin board.

This lady was a great fan of Jane Couch I remember, and her name coincidently was also Jane. I won't reveal her surname for obvious reasons.I have long since lost her email and postal address and I have no idea if she still participates. She was also a fan of Kim Messer, I recall.

she was fascinating to interview(done via email) as she was probably the most shockingingly candid, and bluntly honest person I ever corresponded with. A wee bit like Holly Ferneley, who will also say pretty much whatever comes to her mind, with out fear or regard of public disapproval. (see my interview with Holly at www.womenkickboxing.com/interviews.htm

Holly however does have more tact, and regard for the truly legitimate sensibilites of others -less anyone misunderstand my comment.



As for Jane X, I believe she was closer to 50 years of age at the time...so probably she is now inactive. Who knows? I kind of suspect the UK sports authorities may well have now put a stop to such dangerous spectacles as unlicensed boxing etc-whther male or female.

I mainly enjoyed my correspodent's commentary of some of the old classic female KB tapes I sent her-she was a surprisingly astute boxing analyst-for an untrained fighter.

Her "analyses"/opinions as to the pyschological and freudian motivations of female fighters was fascinating, and often too close to truth for comfort, and definitely not something I would quote or repeat- totally inapproporate for my website.

.

she participated in unlicensed boxing matches, in front of predominately male audiences in the UK. I dont have any of her fights, but I have one tape which contains a few obviously unlicensed fights in the UK, (one witha farily well known English female boxer) and also some Thailand bar fights (surely unlicensed) on tape, as well.

But, let me hasten to add that there are no overly skimpy kits worn on any of my tapes-just to clarify, since Anne mentioned seeing something to that effect.

I think Anne is talking about what is today known as "foxy boxing" which is overtly sexual in its appeal, and the women are sometimes (but not always topless. Its very degradiung and unfair to serious female athletes, imho.

as for the number of female Thai Boxers east vs West, I suspect there are nore in the west-depending on how you define a "legitimate" fighter.

Item: there are inumerable young Thai girls and some older Thai women who boast (for marketing purposes) of having 40, 50, 60, or more fights.

But when they go overseas to fight, they often get "Kod" by gullible American, and European women fighters who invariably have less than 1/3, or even 1/4, or 1/5 of the STATED "experience" of their vanquished Thai opponents.

It always causes me to smile to read the "result" of a fight where a western lady with say a dozen fights or less fights suddenly "KO's" a Thai woman with an *advertised* (by the promoter) record of 40, 50, 60 or more fights.

How gullible can one be??


That why I refuse to rank or even report fights involving Thai women if they do not include their full legitimate passport name.

these "ring names " which Thai fighters genrally adopt are habitually abused badly to allow for the disgraceful and fraudulent exploitation of very poor Thai women who will fight or, Ahem... NOT fight (very hard) just for $$$$$

I have been told by several pro women who have fought in Thailand that a bar girl or even am unabashed hooker will fight a trained pro fighter for a very small amt of money, and risk losing her teeth, or worse-because she desperately needs money for her family to have food on the table.

Editorial: Shame on the western trainers and promoters who exploit Thai women and blatantly embellish their records to build up their own fighters who they know will KO their Thai opponet who has 60 fights (haha) to his fighter's 12 fights.

Again how gullible do they think we are??? but never mind, the Thai girls are using "ring names" so who is going to blow the lid off of the secret scandal?.

And for the Thai girl, no one at home is any the wiser, becasue she calls herslef "Ying Lek Sukothai" or some ridiculous facsimile.

For these reasons, Its not easy to say how many *legitimate* female MT fighters there are in Thailnd.

so to answer your question: My uneducated guess is probably there are more female fighters in the west-IF you include Oceania in the category, "West".

Dan, Lisa Howarth was profiled in a British magazine called Kickboxing monthly August/September 1994 (not published anymore unfortunately)it says this...
'In August 1992 Lisa defended her I.T.B.F World Thai Boxing title against Zelda Tekin in Belgium. Lisa knocked out Tekin in the 5th round retaining her title...'

One from the archives.

www.janpan.co.uk

Sorry, silly mistake.

One from the archives.

www.janpan.co.uk

Great pics, Anne was born too early!

Hi Again Anne
we keep Bumping into each other and Great Archive stuff and as many know ive been a Big campaigner for Lady fighters for Years and even had world lady title fights on my shows.
Also i remember between gyms you trained at my / our original Bolton-Thai-Boxing-Club a few sessions too
A great pioneer ( and like Daves just said )
And the Photo up above with master woody and jack mckeon im sure that was same show i fought on in Bolton?

wow
cheers
sandyman

Could this be Rooijakers?

www.janpan.co.uk/html/rtb.html

Thanks everyone, Angel, veronique lelouier thats the right one! JanP, YES that is indeed Rooijakers, do you are the fight on tape or anymore photo? I would love to see both fights due to not having seen them for very long time.

Sandy, we are a very close family and our paths pass not often enough!

Fighting at 50 got my attention, born too late, yep cant agree more.

Can you spot a young Ricky Hatton?

Can you spot a young Ricky Hatton?