Open Letter Boxing Vs Muay Thai in NZ here is a letter that I have sent off to a few papers. Any comments?

Open letter,

Boxing VS Muay Thai – Crash of the codes.

For too long amateur boxing has tried to keep Muay Thai (often known as Thai boxing or kickboxing) away from the sport of boxing.

This is damaging both codes and I must ask why?

Why are amateur Muay Thai fighters not allowed to complete in boxing competitions? I have been informed that it is because the boxing association does not think that Muay Thai safety checks are enough and that a Muay Thai fighter may get KO’d and then try to fight a couple of days later in boxing. While I support any attempt to ensure the safety of a fighter the current 90 day stand down period between a Muay Thai fight and a boxing bout is ridiculous (this rule is not enforced for anyone who plays rugby gets concussed and then enters the boxing ring!!).

This attitude also appears amongst trainers who are not allowed to associate with Muay Thai exponents, Muay Thai Trainers are not allowed to put boxers into amateur competition because they are not licensed trainers. This seems reasonable - however they are not allowed to become Boxing trainers without signing an affidavit renouncing their sport – this prevents them from becoming boxing trainers and learning about one of the best games on earth.

Strangely this separatist view is only held in the amateur ranks of boxing many Muay Thai fighters such as Ray Sefo, Jaraud Aborruine, Todd Keedwell, Rafael and Daniel Tai were in the New Zealand pro boxing ranks. In fact Daniel Tai gave Sean Sullivan a hard battle in Sean’s last title defense. It cannot be denied that the quality of these competitors has made boxing stronger and improved the pool of competition.

How can amateur boxing avoid this competition and become weaker?

The Olympics is not far away, the hopes of NZ boxing rests on the dedicated individuals who are being hindered by the lack of vision of people who are slow to change and open up competition to all. Many future boxing prospects will already be sparring against Muay Thai fighters and both will learn from those experiences and improve.

Together both codes will only become stronger. And be able to compete against other nations that do not have issues like the Aussies.

Dave Jackson

Excellent !
but whats Dave jackson doing in New Zealand ?
thought he was in Warrington ? U.K. :-p

On the note of boxing and muay thai in NZ, i saw in the paper today that Jordan Tai was fighting a pro boxing fight on fri night at the ABA. He is also fighting the following night in thai boxing on Lollos show.

I remember going to an amateur boxing gym in Te Puke when I was living down that way. I enjoyed the training but was told that I couldn't fight kickboxing if I wanted to do amateur boxing....I never went back to that gym.
Whatever happened to Gil Sullivan, he used to say what he thought about the "old boys" of boxing.

Fighters should be able to fight....end of story.

I think it is more of a case of Amature Boxing being threatend by the posibillities of Amature kickboxing taking over & dominating there Sport.
Which could very posibbly happen.
My reasons on saying this is based on my resent visit to the North Island GOLDEN GLOVES BOXING TOURNAMENT IN TAUPO held over two days just the other month.

Now the GOLDEN GLOVES as my understanding was the mega of Amature Boxing & the most sought after title to have as an Amature Boxer. To be known as the GOLDEN GLOVES CHAMPION. !!!woo that a Title!!! or at least that is what i used to think

Well let me tell you.
Apart from maybe 2 Fights out of the 85-90 fights on the Show.
Any Amature Kickboxer in all weight divisions with about Half a dozen fights (or even less) under there belt could have won the Golden Gloves.
Now That has to be a major concern to boxing having all there golden gloves being in Kickboxers trophy cabinets.

Then there was the spectators
Such a prestegious event you would think to yourself a "FULL HOUSE SOLD OUT"
NOT SO
There was about 150-200 & most of them were fighters waiting for there bout or there trainers. cornermen or the odd supporter from there gym that travelled away with them.
And you would have thought there would have been more of a sell out concidering it only cost $4 to get in. Obvioslly no marketing whatsoever.

GOLDEN GLOVES From my first hand observations has defenatlly taken a dive here in NZ.

BOXING HERE IN NEW ZEALAND REALLY NEEDS NEW BLOOD IN THERE ADMINISTRATION SIDE.
It is time for you old timmers to sit back & let some young blood take over & revive boxing in Nz.
Im not saying you need to let us Kickboxers take it over but you really do need to take some off our more experianced Trainers, Fighters & Promoters advice or ideas to help you guy's get back on track, & be more open to working with Kickboxers.

Affter all, Both BOXER & KICKBOXER have the same Passion.
& that is in that square ring Fighting.

We Kickboxers don't have a problem with you guy's fighting in our ring so why you got the problem with us in fighting in your ring.????????????
Dont be threatend by us "JOIN US" & HELP MAKE NEW ZEALAND BOXING & KICKBOXING A FORCE THAT IT DESERVES TO BE.

don't suppose they are allowed to access this site so all this info could be wasted scotty LOL

On a lighter note there is some in boxing who would like to see the rules changed , the new president of the wellington boxing assoc being one of them , unfortunetly with all inovative approaches, it allways seems a step forward is another set of toes stood on.

I have offerred to promote a couple of amatuer boxing bouts on my shows , this has never been accepted , tough on the competitors I would have thought it much better to compete in front of 1000 plus vibrant fans than perform in front of 100 die hard stalwarts and family friends in the local hall with little or no atmosphere

When i started promoting the boxing assoc had a rule that banned them from renting their boxing rings to us, I bought my own and let it be used all over the country incl the south island , all that did was inconvenience me and cost the boxing clubs the return on the lease of their equip.

As a supporter of both sports I hope to see the day that the two codes can compete together not for Muay Thai's gain but to help the survival of a great sport

Jon...Dixon Maciver asked me a few weeks ago to try and get Jordon a match at my show. I said I will try. Dixon is supposed to be Jordon's manager. I asked around but all the top pro. fighters at the division were not available. Aaron Dixon, Hamid etc..and even considering an overseas opponent. After looking around with no luck, I turned to one of my top amateur fighters and asked him(Simon "Spike" Chamberlain). He accepted.

We started to promote this particular bout (Simon vs Jordon) only to find out by the guy from the Western Leaders News paper that Jordon is due to fight on Friday night. I rang Dixon and said that when it comes to boxing Jordon's father Charlie is looking after that part.(confuse?) He said that before he asked me to try and match Jordon, Charlie (Jordon's dad) was apparently already organised something for Jordon for the Friday night boxing (tonight).

Am I angry about this? Damn right I'm pissed, but there was no contract as it was them who asked me to try and match Jordon up. They say his boxing opponent tonight is weak. That's irrelevent. However I can't do anything about it and only hope he won't injured himself so that he will still fight Simon tomorrow. This is very unprofessional of them, and I must say I'm at fault as well for not tying them to a contract and for being naieve. It's all stuffed up but we still have some exciting bouts for tomorrow anyway.

I know for a fact that Dixon didn't know that the Tai family was trying to get a fight for Jordon.

However, the last time I talked to Jordon and his family (his brothers and his dad) about fighting in my show, they said to ring Dixon first. It just seems that when it comes to boxing, they do their own organising and separate management.

Sorry for going off the topic.

Yes, let's hope that one day we'll work together for the benefit of both codes here in New Zealand.

I would love to put fighters into boxing (amateur) in New Zealand from my gym but the rules doesn't permit me. That's why I coach my native country Tonga at the national level because I still love boxing despite some of the NZ Boxing rulings. NZ rules can stop me here, but they can't stop my passion outside New Zealand.

Old boxing administration needs to be moved on - they have antiquated views which damage their sport and at the end of the day promote ours - they heed to pick up their game or their sport will die a natural death.

Imagine this at one stage about three years ago when Fai Falamoe, Garth De Silva, and Regan Foley were all world ranked amateurs (i.e. top five) they were all coming down to Balmoral for boxing sparring -because their own sparring wasn't strong enough. Even young Santos Pakau came down

In addition - Chris Martin assists Jason Suttie and the boys at Etk, Lollo assists the Tongan Boxing team, Paula Matalele regularly spars the Kickboxing boys, NZ and Aussie kick boxers doing well in boxing include Daniel Tai, Jordon Tai, Chopper Chapman, Ray Sefo, Shane Wijohn, Fai Falamoe is now training kickboxing in Japan, John Conway, Jarhud, Todd Kedwell. Jason Suttie, Peter Graham is fighting over in Aussie and is top five in their heavyweights - not to mention, Alex Tui, Sam Soliman, Paul Briggs, JWP, Daniel Dawson, Mike Cope, Jason Delisle, etc etc etc

At Balmoral many of the boys are also quality boxers

The interesting thing with many of the NZ boys they are using boxing as a warm up for their kickboxing events - and still winning comfortably, this must be a worrying thing for the boxing administrators. At the end of the day if they worked together with they would experience better results for boxing but they fail to see the synergy - and as a result will continue to choke their sport until they either all die clutching on to the old days or they are deposed. What is the greatest pity is that most of the trainers and fighter don't really care they get on well and just want to enjoy the sport.

One of the few guys who has been a leader in this area has been Kevin Barry, when I started training people up at his gym years ago he really hated the thought of Kickboxing contaminating the gym - but after seeing a few of us in sparring with the likes of David (Ray Sefo), Dannie Codling, Robbie Peden, Masalino Masoe, Sam Leuii, Sean Sullivan, Angus Shelford (myself, eddie tongalahi, john conway, Shane Wijohn among others) I he could see the benefits of having the guys involved.

Say what you will about Kevin - he does what is right by his fighters - and at that time it was to get good quality sparring for his fighters, now his gym has a regular kickboxing trainer and even a couple of kick bags...it is interesting to note that Kevin is one of the few people who have made it sucessful in the boxing business - some will say that is own the back of David, I would say it is because he had the vision to recognise an opportunity and the open mind to try it, and unfortunately that is what lacks in most of the boxing administrators in NZ ... they are killing their sport, which is great for Us because we put on the best, most professionaly ruin shows with the best atheletes and well contested fights. Our fighter now go in to boxing gyms not with trediation at gettng a pummeling but looking forward to demonstrating our superior boxing skills over the so called specialists in the sports.

We have the same double standards here in the UK, I put one of my fighters out on a boxing show in Europe. It was supposed to be a relatively novice bout. It turned out to be a "World Title Eliminator".
My guy won by 2nd round KO.
After the fight there was a lot of interest in him from the boxing community and I followed it up in the interest of my fighter.
at the end of the day they said that he had to give up MT if he wanted to box!

Hi Lollo, thanks for the explanation of whats happening with Jordan, i saw the article in the paper and found it of interest that he was fighting twice in one weekend. It was interesting to hear from you what actually happened. It seems rather unprofessional of him, but however im sure your show will be great regardless, with some great fights.
Best of luck to you and the fighters, i hope to make it along.

Great stuff Dave Jackson..LOL!

Thanks Jon...

-Mike Angove writes:
they heed to pick up their game or their sport will die a natural death.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
good! ours is beter anyway.

dan