Had some very interesting results myself and I would like to challenge everyone to try. I mean we should be able to get at least 5 people to try out of how many on here???



I have had some interesting results myself.

Get two equal jars.
Cook some rice (sticky rice is fine lol)
put equal amount in each jar
write on two pieces of paper 1-Thank You and 2-You Fool! (or love and hate etc)
Tape to the jars w/ writing facing in
put aside (not too close together but in same enviroment/room etc) see what happens

Doesn't take much effort and the implecations of the experiement are pretty wild.

I dare you! :)

Don't know what happened there. Missed some of the post...
(computer is messed I think)

anyway its pretty clear from whats there..

I was asking everyone (hopefully a few) to do this experiement..

It may surprise you :)

Mark, how long for?

just leave it to go bad... less than a couple weeks prob

:)

My wife found the jars and asked me if i went mad after she chucked them away!
Now i have to start again....
Mark if i get kicked out of the house i'll come and live with you!
;-)

ROTFL thats awesome LOL :)

I talked my Mum into it and when they got back from England (I came back earlier) and I dropped them off we took a look.. very interesting

She's pretty cool to go along with things.

My parents are out of town again and I stopped by to check on the cat..

She has started the experiment again :). I didn't know.. Had i known I would have got her to do a variation...

atreiu-got it going again or is it banned or your relationship in jeprody? lol

HAAAAAHAAAAA HAAAAAAAA, no Mark, i have been told not to waste food especially rice as it is very bad fung chuy (you know what that is mark?).
my wife's chinese....so "don't play with rice man"!!
You'll have to post some pics for us...

fung chuy-no, sorry i don't know...kinda have a guess..

I think seeing is believing. If I posted pics people wouldn't believe it as its noit in thier belief system... hell even doing themselves they might not believe..

I think you have to do for self...

Then again thats thier prob :) lol

hmmm maybe I'll try to get a digital camera borrowed... parents are home tomorrow so I'll leave a msg not to throw out maybe..

we'll see

fung shuy, fong chuy
i am not sure how you could spell that in english, the translation is fire and water. Its basically the ying and yang, the thai chi comes from it. It also has all those rules about what influence your life everyday, such as light coming trough a window, the position of various furnitures in relations to energy fluxes etc.
In this case it sounds to me like she is using that as an excuse sometimes:
me: baby, time for you to cook!
her: today is bad fung shuy for women cooking, your turn! by the way bad fung shuy to stay on ax too long, people like that rdouble can't be good!!
;)

oh yes... like off angling a path to door etc...

LOL!!

tell her you can't know yang without yin or other way round (?) lol

You must experience this for yourself. The whole thing about the two polarities. You must try it for you to know its bad fong chuy or whatever it is LOL I don't know, might work :P

Do you mean feng shui?

Yeah that's it!
the usual problem is that here in Hong Kong they use cantonese and the word you/we know in the west are generally coming from the Mandarin (mainland China) version. So they are little different.
Bruce Lee is Bruce Lee thoug......

lay ho ma?
Ni how ma?
mm goy
doy chey

lol

put thank you in any language!!!

HEY, mm goy and doy chey...that would be interesting to have those to along with '.........' (only thing 'bad' I could think of was really 'bad' lol

That would be interesting... probably hard to tell though... hmmm

anyway..

lol

waaaaaaaaa the man speaks in cantonese!!!

k took some pics topday of my Mums second experiment (smae as first) took on cell.. just sent to my e-mail and I'll try to get here. Just for you atreiu.

All you who dare not don't even look :P

this is all four sides so before being opened

I'm no expert on decay but the white fluffy mold is an earlier stage, no?

My Mum said she put the same amount in each. you can see how much actual rice is left in the left is less...its much more liquified.

scooped out on to plate... now what really surprised me is the smell.

One smelt off and bad but almost wholesome and lemoney in a way too, the other was just rank.. you can see better the deterioration of the one as there is less...

two close ups left of this plate

love or hate?

love or hate?

man, that's crazy! which one is the one with the "thank you" paper?

the last two close ups, though small pics, you can see one still has some solidness to it.. the other was like cream corn litterally...


www.hado.net for pics of water crystals shown different words...


so ignore this or explain it, disbelieve it or maybe expand your reality :)

oh I htink I suggested thank you and you fool above... my Mum did Love and Hate

lol just saw my wonderful Mum (who put up with giving the experiment a go though she had great disbelief) in the background

(thats Mom for you Americans :P)

One of the pionts this obviously brings up with out getting into how it works...
What do you say, think of yourself?
What do you say and think of others? (Like Marks is wacked!!! lol)
How does that physically effect you and them?

atreiu just emailed me. He's written love on all his underwear :P

lol actually that might not be a bad idea LOL

So if there is truth here (try it yourself) whats say the guy that picks your carrot just caught wife screwing his younger bro... The guy boxing it hates the world, the guy delivering it is stressed out the ass and is full of anger, the kitchen prep guy is pissed cause he has to get up so early and your server, though smiling (sort of) can't stand her job....

would it help, hurt, or do anything to send some love to the carrot before you put it in your mouth...

lol

Think what I'm not talking about LOL

but there is some evidence there for you who will not try ;)

LOL Mark, first things first!
i'll show your pics to my better half and knowing her i know she will go for a try.




The underwear might just follow!!
hahahah

By the way, thanks for the pics

gives a whole new meaning to health food..

to be honest I foget most of time when eating but my ever present water bottle gets smiles and loving thoughts all the time ;)

Who thinks I'm F$#@ED??? lol

oh, these experiments were first done talking to the rice...

One was given love, one hate and some ignored a third...the third rotted fastest and was the nastiest..

Experiments have been done on picked leaves too. One given love a few min a day and one ignored... the one given love lasting longer (with signs of healing where it was torn from the plant)

If you want to blow your mind read "The Secret Life Of Plants".

polygraphs on them and some crazy results...

regardless you can try it for self and believe or not.. doesn't make too much difference to me.

I do know we could all love more and the world would be a better place. Litterally

LOL no worries :) enjoy... its liker a whole new world when you learn about some of these things and start experiencing some of it in life...

k, way late for me to be on line...

HAHAHA I told my lunch I loved it at work today and now none of my co-workers will look me in the eye. Which will do me more damage my lunch feeling neglected or my boss freaking out.

LOL (It doesn't have to be out loud..) lol

thoughts work fine!!

The one poligraph experiment that set if off for one of the the guys that came across plants reacting to us had hooked it up to see if there were changes from feeding it. Then he thought about burning it and the instrement went wild.. That lead him to many experiments.. Even over distance. Scientists would record (machines too) and the plant would react to his experiences while in another city... like him gettin laid for a more interesting example lol

Want to hear something else kinda messed that you may think is just bs...

In India they made a machine that was very sensitive to vibrations and hooked it up to metals etc... after cloriforming the metals they went 'quiet'...the machine no longer picked anything up...

The plant experiments were done independant of each other by many all over the world. In some cases the govs got involved with different ones (like playing music etc) for agricultural reasons and other possibilities too.

Some of them they had the plants feed them selves and if memory serves turn the lights on and off.

In terms of love, water, rice and anything living I think it comes down to simple, even western, science.

Everything is vibrational...

In all reality to your question though marlboro-going on a deeper level, you or your lunch feeling neglected is all dependant on your thoughts and perception and your sources of love. I suspect you wrote all that just cause but I don't care :)

If one needs love from another to feel love then they will feel neglegted without. If one can love self and connect to a greater source (say nature, universe or through own belief system) then one will not feel neglected IMO

SO what is it that slows the decay when love is written on paper and put next to rice??

By the way they have done experiments(water crystals) with pictures, music (what are you listening to?), thought, writing. With writing, they have used peoples names (Mother Theresea and Hitler for example).

For those of you that drink tap water-they show tap water from around the world. Most of it origionally couldn't crystalize, however more resently some is.. I still wouldn't drink it. Bottled water-some would some wouldn't-know your source.

Water, that wouldn't and was nasty-they had monks pray and the water improved and started to be able to crystalize. (it doesn't matter if they are buddist or anything). Actually before the took the photos they could see the improvements.


What about studies of group meditation?? Example. They had thousands meet in NY and the prediction was that crime would be down. The police chief laughed. (they predicted this as they had done it other places first of course) the police chief said something like it out take a snow storm to get crime rates to drop. So they had (thousands Ithink) people all meditate for however long and crime rate did drop a significant amount...more than chance and the police chief became a believer...

Imagine if half the world meditated (or did QiGong or pranic breathing etc etc) for 15 min a day... imagine if you did.

I suspect most of you reading this far are either getting a good laugh or there is something inside you saying there is something here...

Hey if one person gets something out of this I'm happy. :)

If anyones interested you could look into J.C. Bose-he invented the crescograph (detected very very minute movements and amplified them etc-used with plants and metals etc) for this and other inventions he was Knighted in 1917

Mate Ive been on ax too long now. I actually read posts about rotting rice and take the time to have a little chat to my food and dont immediatley write off the idea that my plants feel neglected by me. I will take your advice on the water though and have a little pep talk with it before I drink it, I dont think I could pray at it without seriously warping the signals I sent it.
Atreiu Im busting to know how your experiment went with your love underpants. Did it make a difference? LOL

don't then ;)

So anyone have explinations or thoughts on how this works??

And please don't say it doesn't if you can't muster yup the balls to do the experiment.

the world is flat...the world is round...the world is now know to be mostly empty space...

what is believed from one generation to the next doesn't make it true...

can your ego take the challange and maybe look at a possible 'new' 'truth'?

If this works (I have tried, seen others, and talked to others), what could that mean?

Talking to food, though I am partially joking and partially serious. this is nothing new. Most religions or etc pray over, bless, give thanks etc etc etc
Now it can be shown to have a physical effect not from a belief system its something to laugh at and ridicule.

This type of thinking is what keeps scientific progress vastly retarded IMO

Here we have an experiment that shows when 'good' or 'bad' words are written (also has been done spoken and thought) it has a physical effect.

You can close down your mind to that because its outside the box you built by the time you were 6 years old. But the fact is it DOES do something and DOES have an effect.

What could that mean? If Emoto is right and water reacts much the same (much shorter time) and we are made of 70 odd% water... Could it be worth thinking, speaking and hearing, reading 'good' stuff?

We joke about it cause its wierd and 'new' and not in our belief system. But before we knew what light was or the laws of physics..they still exsisted.

How what we think, say, hear etc effects us from a different angle..

Neuropeptides are basically brain chemicals created from thought and emotion. Well EVERY single immune cell has receptors for these thought/emotion created chemicals...

Its pretty well understood even from a conservative or even old western scientific approach that our thoughts and words do physically effect our health.

Negative thoughts/emotions will directly effect immune function!!

So thinking positive thoughts is always good for us!!! But what if its good for us in more ways than we yet know (more accuratly put ..we yet accept)?

So IF anyone is even reading this...

What can this mean? IF this experiment does work (as I have experienced)... wow thats like a whole new world? Or we can just say haha thats such bull shit because I don't understand it and it doesn't fit into my current knowlage and belief systems with out even looking at its possibility of truth (sounds like typical western approach to me).

Beliefs we got before we were 6 or taught in school by someone who was taught in school who was taught by someone taught in school and many likely never challanged that the world was round.. Maybe the world is flat still...it protects our ego that way.

most religions or cultures etc etc (suppose to be whats said)

challanged world was flat (though round I guess has been challanged and we do know it to be mostly and by mostly I mean HUGELY empty space, so to speak)..so I guess that is fine to say though I ment to put flat

Science is looking more and more into quantum physics, mechanics etc

They took two electrons (from a hydrogen atom I think). They kept one on earth and one they took into space. They wanted to effect the spin on the one on earth and see IF the other would be effected and if so how long it would take. Well the one in space was effected, which is pretty crazy in itself. But it was effected with NO time change!!!!!

They have photographed an object in 2 (or more) places at the same time!!! I mean not two of the same... Just one object but in two places.

They have also found that observation changes matter. That matter, when not observed, actually acts like waves. -so think how this can effect studies and results.. The scientist looking (there ahve been studies done with intention effecting the out come also) effecting what he sees...

It messed up and it certainly doesn't validate our little egos by saying what we were taught by Mummy or Daddy or in school is true.

Of course the world will be flat to most people untill most people think otherwise...

Of course that doesn't make it true or real.. Just saying we hold on to our beliefs like we hold on to life (it is our egos life). Can we dare challenge them?

Can we even see when evidance, like this experiement, suggests there is something we don't know...

http://www.colorado.edu/physics/2000/schroedinger/two-slit3.html

check this out...

its kinda of in the middle of the experiment without loads of info but the electrons are actually acting like waves (best I could find on line in a quick look)..

But when they actually observed it all closely to see why, how, wtf?? Then they formed two lines(like the bullets do). Without observation they acted like waves (like you see in demo)

Wow!!

Matter acting like waves??? Changing due to observation???

Messed up stuff. But this is the stuff they are doing and finding (funnily it ties in and backs up much of what some have known-maybe gnown-for years and years.

"Thomson’s most famous experiment was one that proved an earlier theory developed by Lois de Broglie in 1924. This was that electrons had wave-like properties.

During the middle of the 1920s he carried out a series of experiments using an apparatus called an electron diffraction camera. This instrument is now on display in the Science Museum. With it he bombarded very thin metal and celluloid foils with a narrow electron beam. The beam was then scattered into a series of rings."
http://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/on-line/atomicfirsts/page3.asp

this stuff is fasinating i actually learnt a little about about this in a semiar awhile back but every time i try to tell people about it they think im talking a load of crap there is a book about the experiments that a group of japanese? scientists did called Messages From Water Masaru Emoto i.h.m General Research Institute i havent got round to ordering the book but it was fasinating to look at and similiar to the rice experiments.

reminds me a bit of the old humunculus

I have read a couple of Emotos books...actually where I got this experiment from. :)

I was in a book store and ran across it.. It was pretty wild www.hado.net

I then saw refferance to the studies on "What The Bleep Do We Know".. Then later lerned some more about in a lecture.

They also hve "What The Bleep Down The Rabbit Hole" Its same but with some differances. I like it better but would watch the first first (but which ever way will be the way you should lol)

virginangel-
I've rented them at main video stores here in BC so they shouldn't be too hard to track down. I think you would enjoy!!

Actually much of it is quite old (though as you'll note from comments of others, still not widely understood or excepted). Alot of it Einstein talked about. Also quantum physics proving and showing and pointing towards some of what the great spiritual teachers or way the hell back have been saying.

I mean I read a book by a guy that lived in the 1800 and 1900s who explained the SCIENCE of some of what they believed. After his death science is finally catching up and showing some of what these old cultures have said for ever to possibly (if not more strongly) be correct and have truth.

Like the act of observation changing matter...the power to change matter with will etc...

bloody sci-fi but western science is looking at this and it supports what has been talked about since way wy back..

I did something yesterday that may be of interest.

Its similar to the rice experiment.

For anyone who is not familular with muscle testing, basically you test the strength of a muscle and if you can get a clear differance between strong and weak you can use it to ask the body questions.

The body cannot lie! So if you have someone test and they are strong and then lie to you ('my name is bob dylan') and test them again they become weak.

If you can get a clear response then you can go on and do with lots of things. Hold soy and muscle test. If your body will do well on soy you will test strong and weak for not good for you.

Great test for those 'contriversial' issues like soy and meat/veg etc

Anyway. I did a test yesterday that I had never done before. I did it while presenting a workshop.

I wrote love one one piece of paper and hate on another and but it into seperate envelops. I had done this the day before and I had no idea which was which.

I had a volunteer choose one and we muscle tested and then with the other.

There was a very strong difference! With love being a strong response and hate being weak (actually the second was hate and she looked at her arm in disbelief at how fast it dropped and how weak it was)

I knew this would work but had never done it.

(there is a bit of skill and practice to muscle testing but that said the basics are easy if you know how)

So the question is, if the energy from it being written is that powerful...what do you read? what do you watch? what do you listen to? What do you think??

Powerful stuff. You may choose to disbelieve but ask yourself. Do I htink Mark is lieing? that he is dellusional? or is my disbelief apart of my programming about what is?

If you think OI am lieing thats fine with me, or delusional. :)

At boxing today I had a guy think hate and muscle tested him and then think love and muscle tested him. BIG difference in strength.

What are you thinking when you train.

Positive thoughts have a very real effect on the body and muscle testing is a simple way tp show that.

Never mind that there are receptor sites all over the body for the chemicals produced from our different thoughts and emotions.

What mental state are you in when you train?

Another thing I did..I was considering if I should say..

I muscle tested a guy and behind him I had two other students projected into him (he didn't know what they were doing).

The first time they projected love.. he tested strong.
The second time they projected hate.. tested weak.

I don't know about you guys but this is powerful stuff to me...

What our thoughts do to us and to those around us... Even writing!

Thoughts travel around the world (if memory serves) 7 times a second (maybe its in seven seconds..). regardless what effects does that have?

Quantum physics tells us that each thought we have effects the entire universe.

Even if you don't go that far it is very clear from many view points that our thoughts effect us at least and we effect those around us in many many ways if not just by being there.

Question is what are we contributing to in our lives and bodies and to those around us?

In terms of fighting... do you want to be strong or weak? Do you think negative thoughts or positive thoughts will make you better fighter?

To me there is no question.

No one think that is wild? Or scared to say? Or think I'm crazy (or full of shiht lol)?

Dr emoto and his theories

photographers are instructed to select the most pleasing photographs. Emoto says that he selects the photos that he wishes for consistency. This is an explicit admission of observer bias.

James Randi, founder of the James Randi Educational Foundation, has publicly offered Emoto one million dollars if his results can be reproduced in a double-blind study. Randi has also stated that he does not expect to ever have to pay the million dollars.

in 1992 he received certification as a Doctor of Alternative Medicine from the Open International University for Alternative Medicine in India, an unaccredited institute with minimal academic requirements.

So hes not even a doctor.

One of his peers
Dr. William A. Tiller, another researcher featured in the movie What tнe Bleep Do ωΣ (k)πow!?, has pointed out that Emoto’s experiments fall short of proof, since Emoto's experiments do not control for one of the three key factors in the supercooling of water. See Tiller, William, 2005, "What the Bleep do we Know!?: A Personal Narrative", in Vision in Action (VIA), Vol. 2, Issues 3-4, pages 16-20.

Found this interesting article

There’s no evidence water can understand human speech

I am a scientist/artist with a doctorate in biomedical research who has 17 patents for three-dimensional microscopes, and currently I make art through the microscopes I’ve invented.

Many people ask me, "Have you seen the movie ’What the Bleep Do We Know?’ and do you know about Emoto’s work with microscopic ice crystals?"

They say, "Dr. Emoto has proven that words can change the molecular structure of water, simply by talking to water or labeling bottles of water with good or bad words. He can communicate with water."

As a scientist, I was astonished. It didn’t surprise me that I couldn’t find any scientific experiments he has performed or any peer-reviewed journal articles that have been published describing controlled studies of Emoto’s work. A further search revealed that Emoto’s degree was from the Open International University in India, where an M.D. degree costs $500 and a Ph.D. costs $350, no classes or tests required.

Emoto has been very successful lecturing on Maui and will be returning for a talk Feb. 7 at the Tropical Plantation. I would like Emoto to answer this question: Why has he not published controlled scientific experiments in credible peer-reviewed journals?

It is wrong to bolster an argument with false evidence, no matter how good or important the message might be. I believe that only the path of truth will lead to a genuine understanding of nature and the magnificent universe that we live in.

But, what the bleep do I know?

Gary Greenberg

Paia

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/clusqk.html#EMOTO

Experts would not even look through Galileo's telescope to see if what he was saying might be true. How we look with "science" to validate our beliefs is hugely subjective and biased. Quantum physics has quite a bit of evidence showing that matter is even effected by observation and certainly intention. "Science and Human transformation" - William Tiller documents many experiments.

"Well, if the water in your body is anything like the ideal shown at the top, then I have bad news: you are dead, and are no doubt residing in a deep-freeze! This is not a "molecule" at all, but an ice crystal..."
http://www.chem1.com/CQ/clusqk.html#EMOTO

How ridicule is used here I find interesting and a common way of attacking anything out side the current dogma. It's common on what is suppose to be unbiased news reporting on American news networks. News is suppose to be about facts.

What is offered above is simply an attack as I see it. As far as I understand Dr Emoto never claims that water crystallizes in the body, that indeed would be crazy. I am not aware of him suggesting he is taking photos of molecules either.

It's interesting to me that an experiment that anyone can do has been shared yet it is ridiculed without being tested for the individual.

If you look at the fact that everything is energy and vibration, which is hard science, though a bit woo woo for many still, one can think of how different vibrational frequencies affect each other.


Two waves will have an impact on each other.

Homeopathic medicine is all about a "imprinting" water etc

Most important to me is doing the experiment and seeing results myself. Not what anyone else tells me and not what my belief system (most of which was programmed into me as a child) says.

It doesn't surprise me that the dogmatic scientific community isn't interested in repeating the experiments nor do big pharma and the like paying for it.

If science means that it has to be accepted by the scientific community then I'd be happy not to call it science.

All I know is I have done the experiment (rice) and seen results. I have also tested water in other ways (that I am comfortable with - muscle testing one of them) and seen consistent results.

Don't agree? Cool. Ridicule it? Cool.

You sharing William Tillers thoughts (link would be great) is more solid for me. Proves what is the question... I don't think they prove anything either. They do offer some wild evidence. The evidence suggests and pure proof are two different things. I would suspect that more experiments need to be done to make it proof...but who is going to fund it?

why wouldnt they look through galileos telescope...because if what he said was true it would mean the church was wrong and what they said was wrong....all that they had told people to just believe would be wrong.

Their beleif had no scientific foundation nor does emotos.

He probably doesnt accept the science that shows what he does to be wrong either...nor will people that follow what he says...cause they become entrenched in that belief system.

The scientific method doesnt unfortunately have a lot to do with the blind faith that the church at the time required..or what emoto requires.

His own peers, seriously question his validity......free your mind.

I would rather smoke 50 a day than listen to this guy with no qualifications and no evidence .

Sure hes found images that would look nice on my hallway wall but i think thats about it.

I dont ridicule it others do that already.

Believe in it hell no....theirs no proof.

I mean have you done tests for bacterial growth before?

Tested for colonies?

Even under the strictest conditions theirs so much bacteria called 'rain' in the air falling randomely onto what ever your incubating...like rice that the results would be hard to determine and how can you isolate 1 thing like a word unless you did the test in triplicate at the same time under the same conditions and also did blind tests as well.

Of course you would have to make sure the jars were completely sterile aswell as the lids.

you would have to open the jar for a minimal amount of time near a heat source to keep the rain from entering the jar.

All implements would have to be heat reated and sterilised before and after each use.

for all jars. then incubated in the same place for the same length of time.

then you might start getting somewhere.

I dont believe something cause someone tells me, or because it fits into my belief system well.

But hey each too their own.

I also would question someone who pays for his doctorate....doesnt seem trustworthy to me.

"Their belief had no scientific foundation..." I disagree. It on;y doesn't because we believe differently now. Holding onto scientific beliefs now or then is no different. Every generation has their world is flat beliefs and scientific facts are constantly changing. Ego holding onto a belief and not even checking it out for self is no different. Depending who you talk to 95% of brain function is subconscious. BEFORE we have a conscious thought (we think we think for self) the brain compares the incoming info to all the subconscious beliefs and what we have been taught and past experiences, a huge percent being put there before we are 7 years old. THEN we have a conscious thought on it and we think we are thinking for ourselves.

Some people figure about 1% of the worlds population are "free thinkers". Studies on memetics and brain washing figure about 2% of the world has "access to their own minds"

One powerful way to allow possibilities and changing awareness is to be curious. "I know" shuts off to what is already programmed into the subconscious. "So far my experience suggests this but I am curious if there might be another possibility" - this allows a chance for the brain to entertain a possibility.

"Imagination is more important than knowledge" Dr E was a brilliant man.. his ideas came way beyond anything he knew... Curiosity and experimenting with possibilities lead further than what everyone else told him was true.


Science gets stuck in knowing. When something happens that cannot be explained with old science. It is often ignored. Research also often looks for something and no matter what comes up they go back and try till they find what they want.

Some don't look through the telescope. I sure as hell know that I don't always look through it. That is human nature. Ego feels threatened when something outside of its understanding comes into play. Ego is about control.


Most people could be discredited or supported depending on if their beliefs match ours.

My experience, from actually doing experiments, suggest to me that there is something behind his work. That may change. And others may find different results. :)

So im gathering that you didnt follow a very strict protocol really rendering the experiment useless due to so many contributing factors?


Do you know what the scientific method is?

Im pretty open to most things but I question most things too. Emoto could make it as an artist ,,,actually not even that cause he gets others to pick the photos under his instructions. Dodgey

Here I was thinking that for galelio he was using some science and trying to fight agaist religious belief in that the earth was the center of the universe because god made it and us and we are the most important.....thats not very scientific it is how ever an unubstantiated claim that no one could really disprove and if they did it would be very unchristian.

Sacreligious infact.

I think science has moved further and further away from being affected by religion and unfounded beliefs...I mean the theory of evolution didnt really do god many favours did it.

Science isnt the be all end all. There is still human error etc in experiments which is why there are protocols to follow.

Emoto sounds dodgey and isnt reall a doctor and claims to use science to back up claims but doesnt use scientific methods.....sorry if that upsets you but even his peers dont support...thats telling.

Beliefs are beliefs, regardless if they are religious or not. Certainly religious beliefs have a lot of defense and offense memes and are very strong (not saying they are true or not but they are still beliefs).

I hared what I did and others have done. If that doesn't mean anything to you, fair enough. :)

Its does mean something to me, But like I was saying Ive got to question the protocol with the results. Im planning on doing my own tests soon when I get the chance and try to eliminate all the things that I think were wrong about the method that you may have used.

Im going to try to follow the scientific method and also use some blind tests changing one perameter.

The thing withe science experiments is that it is recrded in thorough detail and is able to be repeated by other people....repeatability.

My experience is they are repeatable and I have done blind testing.

The rice one is pretty simple. You could do in a lab and take notes ever 25 minutes. but basically you put cooked rice in a two jars, write on them, and see what happens. I wouldn't put them too close together but i would also make sure you put them in the same place, close to each other keeping the environment as much the same as possible.

In terms of muscle testing. I have used it almost daily for months and use it routinely with clients.

If yo want a scientific mind explaining and teaching muscle testing I recommend Dr David Getoff's DVD's on muscle testing... 6 or 7 of them. This guy is extremely left brained and very much by the book.

He is a skeptic of many forms of muscle testing that are, in his words, "not scientific" such as surrogate muscle testing (which proves very consistent in my experience).

I have muscle tested with a toxin (cell phone for example). The person being tested and myself do not know when the cell phone is placed close to their body (someone behind them). Phone comes close - subject weakens.

I have put different products in film canisters also. If memory serves I remember using nutrasweet, sugar and stevia in one test and different types of water and milk in another (processed and raw). No one knows which are which. test, mark results and them look what is inside.

Consisitent results.

In terms of Emoto style I have also written words on paper, put in envelops and had random ones handed to the subject when I tested them. no one knowing the content.

Consistent results.

It is possible for people to test weak to love and strong to hate. If reversals are corrected before testing i have yet to see someone test backwards. If the test shows up backwards and the reversdal done then they test normal.

You cannot reverse from "good" to "bad" so its not a matter of simply switching to get the desired result.

If you wanted to be sure sure you simply reverse all before the test.

However it is relatively rare to get backwards results to poisons like aspartame or sugar and decent quality water.

It is possible for someone to be reversed on all results...meaning they would test weak when they say the truth (like name) and strong with a lie (false name).

This is why you always calibrate the test with a known.

Just like checking a scale with a known weight before weighing anything else.

If you get clear results on true and false with name you are usually good to go.

There is an art and practice to making sure you are getting clear responses. Anything unsure should simply not be counted as you always want solid responses to base anything on.

If you want to see how energy flows through people line up 5 people (10, 20 doesn't matter - I do this at workshops). Have them all touch. At one end of the line you muscle test and you ask questions of the person at the other end of the line. Have one end state their name and them muscle test the other end. then have them say "my name is George Bush" (or what ever you want to throw in) and the testing end of the line will be weak.

Maybe that isn't scientific but it sure is fun and shocks a lot of people.

When I do blind testing it is mostly at workshops with strangers.

Could I manipulate the results? Yes I could. Never mind science actually shows that simple observation, never mind intention, effect out come.

Might not sound scientific but being inn a place of curiosity of the results will keep you out of screwing them up.

I can intentionally effect the test.

If i muscle test someone and simply ask in my mind for their body to show me weak, there arm goes weak (some is strong enough that they can feel the weakness before I even test or as you start to test the arm just drops) The in my mind ask to see strong and bang!

Sound fucked up? Can you back that with science? Well you are automatically getting involved. Science is under the illusion that the scientist is neutral. But Quantum mechanics shows how we interact with our environment.

Is it scratching it all out cause I can influence it by thought? Or do you ask "what the hell is going on if thought does this and what do we not know and are not taught in school?"

Get a base rate of strength, then slash your finger across the chest diagonally and test again. You'll find the subject weaker. (most will look at you like what the fuck). Tap on the thymus 10-15 times and test again and ytou will find them strong.

Can science explain it. Not reductionist Newtonian science... quantum physics has some interesting thoughts though.

Dude , this is the water experiment thread.

Not another muscle testing one...is that called trolling.

Any way Im talking about the water testing, rice experiment and due to your methods unfortunately they are not repeatable.

Have you had much lab experience?

Im guessing not as its pretty rigid in experimental protocols...like what I outlined above.

Did you read what I posted? Im guessing not.

Im going to try to perform the experiments ina more controlled enviroment altering only one variable with blind tests and in triplicate.

you didnt do this.

What sterilisation technique did you use.

what about the jars etc....you left your experiment so open to so many variables its not funny. That is why any one with any kind of lab experience or scientific background generally will find the results meaningless.

Sorry if that upsets you but thats how it is.

Only one variable should be different...that being the words...right cause thats all your testing.

The amount of rice should be the same...weighed out. from the same cooked batch.

all equipment should be sterilised preferably with ethanol then flamed before connection with rice to stop contamination from rain bacteria.

jars should be upside down on sterilised bench to stop rain entering while prepering rice...........etc etc etc etc.

This is what I will endeavour to do other wise your testing to many things at once and then it becomes meaningless.

Science is not fact its theory.

Theorey is just a good hypothesis backed up by experiments.

new discoveries and experiments can disprove a theory easy. happens all the time.

You say your rice experiment is repeatable could you email me the data so I could repeat it the including weights and measures ...thanks

Mark you wrote about your test

One smelt off and bad but almost wholesome and lemoney in a way too, the other was just rank.. you can see better the deterioration of the one as there is less...

What strikes me is that there is no scale and if you want to see something you will see it ..

like I saw this test where they put three glasses of courless lime juice on a table and then coloured one red, one blue and left one clear.

Nearly every one thought that the red one was rasberry, the blue one blue berry and the clear one lime.....they were all the same.....lol.

Wonder if you really wanted a sweetness some where in the rank smell of one. Its all interpretive so hard to quantify really.

I think Hamish makes some good points.

Scientifically testing things depends greatly on the little details. If you're not controlling the experiment as much as possible to reduce variables (known or unknown) then the experiment really is botched from the beginning. Who knows, you might have breathed on one batch of rice more than the other. It's difficult to say.

Still, I'm not against the idea that there is a possibility for forces to exist that are currently unknown to science, or that there are relationships that we haven't discovered yet. I mean...why not?

But I would personally like to see a controlled experiment, and hopefully peer-reviewed as well. It's just a path to finding the truth. It is a pain in the ass though. SOOO much more difficult than just doing the experiment the way Mark did it.

Hamish, why don't you attempt the experiment in a proper manner?

Im on the fence to date on this stuff and second:

"Hamish, why don't you attempt the experiment in a proper manner?"

Yeah I will.

Other people have performed the experiments of dr emoto and have always gotten inconclusive results but that figures because dr emoto tells the photographers to pick the best photos.

So its a misrepresentation of data.

Ive got a lot of exams coming up so it may be in a while like a month but I will do it.

I am not offering scientific proof (which really science shows strong evidence not proof). My intention is not pretend to be a scientist nor debate facts... I am sharing thoughts and personal experience.

One can look at possibilities and try things out or one can say I don't buy it.

though the rice experiment hasn't been done in a totally controlled state I find it interesting that results, in my experience, have been consistent.

Muscle testing - with just words written on paper - offer me the experience of the same results. Like I said I have done this blind...

It might be outside our belief system but applied and behavioral kinesiology has been around for a bit.

I use it with clients very frequently and find out things about them that they sometimes have never shared with anyone (i offer one example recently on the rock music thread) and this is done without voicing the questions... sometimes I find hidden traumas too..

To me that supports it works and just like words on water or rice, I see a result with people time and time again.

Buy it or don't... the possibility of experiencing it has been offered.

maybe it only works for me and maybe I am delusional or full of shit ;)