As a kid i used to hear a lot about Dennis Alexio and how he was the best Heavyweight Kickboxer around. Anyone know what happened to him?

Hammer

He now weighs 600 pounds and has a little 18 yr old Hawaiin girl taking care of him as he lays in bed and watches videotaped episodes of the Simpsons and Married with Children all day. He does take time to use the bed pan once or twice a day but is fairly sedentary now and has retired from the ring as no one can make shorts big enough to fit him.....

Sorry.....I couldn't resist.

wow...! My hero!!! lol

He became a world champion diver in Hawaii. No kidding :-) They have competitions for those things.

The leg break from Stan in Australia is what did him in. After that, he wouldn't fight with leg kicks because the doctors messed up and shaved the screws off of the rod in his leg. The rod is still in his leg. It's more like a hollow tube that runs alongside, so I've heard. Then above waist matches became so unpopular, so no fights.

He did fight a low kick bout about 3-4 years ago? Against some small japanese opponent. So perhaps they figured out a way to remove the rod.

He just has no reason to fight anymore. He evidently has made a good life for himself in Hawaii.

I think he'd make BANK in appearance fees if he fought in K-1 today though. No matter who he fought.

Dennis Alexio was a fantastic Kickboxer. Great hands and awesome kicks! He did the sport a great service by fighting regulary on ESPN. He just looked good doing Kickboxing. A big fan...All you idiots who bash Alexio are just jealous of his success. The man was a tremendous World Champion. Not a boxkicker, but a bonafide Kickboxer!!! Lay off him. Give him the credit he deserves....

Dennis lives in Hawaii with his wife and child and still trains daily.
He says he would still fight if the offer was right but as everyone knows, he really has nothing to prove in the full contact rules arena.

However, there are three opponents that would still make a good fan fight for Dennis.

There have been talks as recently as a month ago about matching Dennis and Stan Longinidis again or Dennis and Rick Roufus. These would be the best opponents for a final fight for Dennis if he were to retire after it.
Alexo's only fight problems came in leg kick bouts. His only 2 loses were in leg kick bouts to Longinidis (The famous leg break) and Don Wilson and a questionable finish against Branko Cikatic in Las Vegas.

However Dennis and Rick Roufus never met in the ring under any rule style.
Alexio vs Roufus is probably the best full contact heavyweight match today, regardless of Dennis' age and the comments of being "Past his prime." by some. However, as good as it could be, it may never happen since purse money may forever keep them apart.

To many promoters this was the dream bout match-up many wanted to do in the mid to late 90's. However when K-1 came along it took the focus off of a full contact (Above the waist) rules bout. Roufus went into leg kicks as many fighters have, for the money that stopped flowing in full contact style fighting. A switch that shortened many fighters careers.

Regardless of the stabs many take at Alexio, he was clearly the best ever full contact rules heavyweight kickboxer in the world in his prime. He won his IKF Heavyweight World Title against Barrington Patterson of London, England by TKO at the end of the 5th round In Hawaii, USA on May 31st, 1997. He defended it once against Achille Roger of Dijon France on May 1st, 1998. It was over at 1:10 of the 4th round and Alexio had once again, as he has done 66 times before, acknowledged the crowd as the winner. The knockout gives Alexio 62 on his pro career. He still holds the IKF World Title today.

We said there were THREE opponents left for Alexio... The third would be even a greater long shot... A chance for Alexio to redeem his loss to Don Wilson. However, at Wilson's weight now, Light Heavyweight - 172.1 lbs. - 179 lbs. or 78.2Kg - 81.3Kg such a bout would be very doubtful.

Regardless what his future holds, it's too bad the opportunities and money stopped flowing in his rule style of fighting. Not that it's flowing in "ANY" style. K-1 is no answer either, only offering opportunities to heavyweights and even they have to be "Invited" to get a shot at the big money. And what a trip to even get to that big money... Some fighting in as many as 3 tournaments just to get to the grand prix. Most of the K-1 regional events don't pay big either. Do the math, 3 fights for $5,000.00..... Nothing great there... Not to mention some of the even smaller regional K-1 tournaments that pay $2,500 grand prizes for the 3 wins... and a flat $500 to everyone else in the tournament.

The fact is, the fighters deserve more. The whole sport deserves more. But isn't this the same gripe that sent fighters like Alexio and MANY others into different careers...

Lets hope we all live to see this sport be rewarded for what it needs instead of working ourselves to death trying to "Make It Happen!"

I agree 100%. Alexio is the man!!!

Big fish in a small pond.

I thought he did well in 'Kickboxer'...but I guess its not hard when compared to Van Dam. :)

I am not bashing or taking a stab at Alexio and was just joking. I will say that Alexio was a good kickboxer, was exciting and liked watching him fight. He was ahead of his time for sure.

I was sitting ringside at the Alexio - Cikatic fight in Vegas and I thought that it was Cikatic who got screwed around, not Alexio. If my memory serves me correctly it seems to me that Branko was never in any trouble and was at the very least holding his own.

Who knows what really happened in the Longinidus fight but I did not think that the leg break came from a hole or soft spot in the ring. I thought a Longinidus kick is what broke his leg.

Maybe he could take Longinidus now, I don't know. I don't know if he could take Roufus either but Roufus has been fighting fairly regularly, Alexio has not. I think a Don Wilson fight is out of the question at this time.

IKF - Let me ask you this - How long has it been since he fought? 4 years? How does he still hold the IKF World Title today??? I mean, usually a champion needs to fight and must defend his title every 6 months to a year? Am I missing something?

Matt you are wrong. He was the biggest fish in a big pond. When Alexio fought in his prime. Their were only two main sanctioning bodies. PKA and WKA. PKA was all Full-Contact and WKA had leg kicks. Alexio was a Full-Contact kickboxer, who was the biggest,baddest one out their. He fought Don Wilson, because the fight was shown on NBC's Sprtos World. A prime time show featuring Kickboxing. This was his first leg-kick fight. He did it for the exposure.And he felt he could beat Wilson. Wilson clearly won the fight. But Wilson was an experienced leg kicker when the fought! Now their are a zillion sanctioning bodies. So all the champs now are big fish in a little pond. Give the man his due. You guys who bash him, don't know jack-s--t, about the Kickboxing world.

I don't think it was ever that big of a pond. Alexio had trouble finding good opponents.

I liked Alexio a lot whenever I've seen him fight.

The only thing that bothers me about Dennis is that he said in a prefight interview against Darrel Hannegan that he prefers low kicks and that's his style of preference but Darrel didn't want to fight with them.

After his leg break, that seemed to change. Understandably. But I think Dennis did well enough with leg kicks, especially if he had more fights using them. He dominated in above waist style mainly (I think) because he was REALLY good with his hands, using them in combination and tearing up the body with them. If he fought in K-1 today, he would have trouble because of the clinching inhibiting his inside punching game. Since his stature is shorter than average then he would have his major advantage taken away and have trouble with distancing.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. no bashing.

after alexio lost to stan in australia (he got kicked rockhard, dont believe the hole in the ring story, the tape is out there) he kind of disappeared which i always said was a shame for a man of his calibre. nevertheless he does not need to fight anymore and being into his 40's easily now, why should he? who he could or couldnt take now is fantasy, i believe these guys know there day is over and there generation is past,
but remember that many people who trash him say he lost the two biggest fights under low kick rules of his career (wilson and stan) but this is not true because he had quite a few low kick bouts and won them,
also remember that under fc rules he never lost and though the division was not always deep its still remarkable to win all those fights without being upset by an underdog, refer to many of todays newer generation of fighters who lose to HUGE 'dogs, it happens every show these days. everyone is dangerous if your not mindful 100% of the time,
so over 65 fights and only 2 defeats against top tier guys is a record many wish they could atain.

brian i saw that fight where he berated henegan saying he wanted to fight leg kicks but henegan didnt want to. i think after what happened against stan though, anyone would change there mind :)

Who is bashing him Goof??? I don't see anybody in this thread BASHING him. What I see is people expressing their opinions that he may not be as great as you say he was. Yes, he was very good and had a fair amount of fights and fought some decent fighters. He did not however do as well fighting with legs kicks. Ok, as a full contact fighter he was very good. But stick him in with Hoost or Aerts with legs kicks and knees and he would get trounced. HE was on his way to getting beat by Cikatic too! Sorry if that makes you think I don't know jackshit about Kickboxing but I would dare say I know more than you think. Also - I don't really give a shit about full contact as I like leg kicks and elbows - namely - I like Muay Thai! At this point, Alexio is a has been (as is Don Wilson and many others) who at one point was an excellent fighter in his sport.

more ppl would have respect for alexio but he let his mouth override his ass.

if dennis were in his prime right now he would not be that big of a deal.

and the idiotic ppl who don't like dennis do so because of the idiotic things he said and claimed,not to mention being a poor loser.

maybe dennis should have remained a full contact fighter,but in his own words fancied himself a leg kicker.
he was furious when darrell hennigan would not fight him with leg kicks.
dennis ran his mouth about the subject and got called on it.

"and the idiotic ppl who don't like dennis do so because of the idiotic things he said and claimed,not to mention being a poor loser.

what were the idiotic claims? not disagreeing at all kirk because i'm aware he rubbed people the wrong way, just curious.


"maybe dennis should have remained a full contact fighter,but in his own words fancied himself a leg kicker.
he was furious when darrell hennigan would not fight him with leg kicks.
dennis ran his mouth about the subject and got called on it."

called on it? i don't follow the american expression. :)

called on it means like getting what u ask for.
he wanted to fight darrell who was completely a fc fighter,and not a bad one at that.he yammers about not having his way.and then says stan is no threat.well he got what he wanted a leg kick fight from a guy that was no threat.the rest is history.

While I think he was a good fighter, Alexio had a big trap and I was glad to see Stan the Man shut his piehole. While I like watching him, I never did like Alexio's personality that he displayed in public....As you Brits say - I thought he was a wanker! or twit!

To Rockhard;

RE:
"IKF - Let me ask you this - How long has it been since he fought? 4 years? How does he still hold the IKF World Title today??? I mean, usually a champion needs to fight and must defend his title every 6 months to a year? Am I missing something?"

Your comments of "USUALlY" are from someone who doesn't understand all the particulars of how a fight is put together. To better understand this, please see this page on our IKF web site;

http://www.ikfkickboxing.com/RulesTitleDefenses.htm

To be brief, in the IkF, unlike other sanctioning bodies, we do not "FORCE" A Champion to pay us sanctioning fees every 6 months and pay their own money to "Promote their own title defense."
In boxing, as an example, there are many neutral promoters, meaning promoters who are not promoting to help their own fighters. Also, in boxing there is a lot of TV and TV Money to make challenges and defenses happen more often. Since winning his title, NO ONE has made any formal challenge towards Dennis. Many have claimed they want to fight him, but all wanted "Dennis" to promote the show, which makes NO SMART Business sense for the person who is the World Champion, in this case, Dennis. These fighters, the few they were, would ask for example, $25,000 to fight him, some as high as $100,000. Keep in mind most of them were fighters who never made over $2,500 in a purse. Sure, a lot of people may claim they want to fight him but getting a promoter together who can promote the show and the purse money needed to pay the fighters is what everyone seems to forget to consider.

In addition, we don't expect someone like Dennis to fight for $2,500.00 on another show which is what another leading organization tried to force him to do. The organization wanted to make their $2,500 in sanctioning fees ( A lot more than IKF Charges for a World Title) so they pressed the issue saying, "If you don't fight for this price, we'll strip you of your title." He said no, and they stripped him, to offer the title to fighter who's trainer was promoting the event... All for MONEY.

Sorry, but the IKF will always side with the Fighter, not the INCOME...

As far as the Cikatic fight in Vegas, we too were there at ringside. We DID NOT like what Dennis did. He should have been DQ'ed for his actions (Hitting Cikatic while the referee was still holding his hand)

don't get us wrong, we are not saying Dennis was a saint, or perfect at all. His personality has hurt him far more than helped him. Anyone who knows him agrees to this.

HOWEVER.... The "FACT" is, he was probably the GREATEST FULL CONTACT FIGHTER EVER. As much as we hate some of the things he's done, we all need to open our eyeas to this. This pond and fish talk is just that... TALK. As already been said, give credit where credit is due...

Rockhard writes:
"While I think he was a good fighter, Alexio had a big trap and I was glad to see Stan the Man shut his piehole. While I like watching him, I never did like Alexio's personality that he displayed in public....As you Brits say - I thought he was a wanker! or twit!"


We can't argue here. Many have thought this very same thing. It's too bad he was this way. But again, love him, hate him, we can't deny his skill...

Us Brits never say twit, honest !!!!!

I may not understand in depth the particulars of the fight game but there are a few things that I do know and understand and also some questions that need to be delved into.

1) How long will Alexio be the champion under your rules before his title is vacated as nobody has challenged him? 5 year? 10 years? Is he going to have to formally retire before the tile is vacated?

2) Champions fight and want to fight. From my limited knowledge, it does not seem like he wants to fight or he might already be fighting some of the big names today. He is not. Not only that but it seems like boxing DOES have the right idea having people be 'forced' as you put it into fighting every year. They shouldn't have to be forced if they are a true champion and most fighters fight at the very least 1-2x per year.

3) Boxing's organizations are indeed a joke but they don't allow the fighters to lay idle as champions for numerous years without ever fighting. A fighter who is a champion needs to fight...Bernard Hopkins fought for years making small purses before he finally made it with the Trinidad fight.

4) I never have liked Alexio personally from what I have seen of him but a) that doesn't mean if I knew him I would feel that way and b) nor do I deny that he was very talented and c) what I think about him really doesn't matter as it doesn't affect his skill level. I am not disputing that he was very talented.

5) Perhaps I am wrong but while I understand you don't wish to force anyone to pay sanctioning fees, shouldn't you FORCE the top rated contender and the champion to fight? I mean, if they can't agree on the purse, then shouldn't it go to a purse bid or is that too optomistic?

While I understand the intent of the IKF and feel it is trying to do side with the fighter and not income, I can't understand the logic of - NO ONE has made any formal challenge towards Dennis so he will remain champion until he is challenged and loses. What is that? You are the sanctioning body, why don't you mandate that he defends his title? I just don't believe that a champion can sit on his ass for 4 years and still keep his title. Is that right or wrong? In my eyes, money or not, sanctioning fees or not, he needs to defend his title.

I agree with the IKF. You may not like him for his personality, but give him credit for being an awesome Champion. This BS. with, if he fought this guy or that guy with leg kicks he would be destroyed is unjust. The fact that he won 99% of his fights and most by KO is the bottom line. Again I say to those with a chip on their shoulder over Alexio are green with envy over his fantastic career!!!

I'm not fond of him and me saying I think he would get his ass kciked by one guy or another is my opinion. Sorry if you don't like it but I don't think Alexio is as great as you do. How many flippin times do I need to state that he is extremely talented before you read it? Again - as you are entitled to think he is an awesome champion, I am entitled to think what I want. I think he's a talented asshole and DO think that he would be destroyed by a good leg kicker....and he was - Longinidus ended his career! How he would do gainst others is purely conjecture and is my opinion! Until he fights Hoost or Aerts, it will remain that!

Again you say. "If he fought Hoost or this guy"... Well he didnt! get over it. Anyone can say "well if he fought...". Thats like winning a singing contest and you whine, "Well, if he sang against...". Face it. You are a "he should of, would of, could of" crybaby.

Goofy - Why don't you go blow him then if you like him so much? Jesus man, READ THIS SENTENCE - How he would do against others is purely conjecture and is my opinion! Until he fights Hoost or Aerts, it will remain that! Are you lacking education or do you not understand that sentence? Address the points I made and stop licking Alexio's ass!

Ok - He did fight Wilson, got beat. He did fight Cikatic - was on his way to getting beat, fought Longinidus - BYE BYE

Alexio is as I say once again - talented. In my opinion he is not NEARLY as great as you think Goofy.....if you don't like that, tough SHIT!

You keep bringing up the point. "Until he fights so and so" You don't get it.Saying how he would do against other fighters is great and is purely conjecture. But to then try to bash his career based on your purely conjecture matchmaking theories is just wrong. What claim do you have to justify anything? Have you fought. Do you know what it take to be a real fighter. How many fights have you had? Did you win one of those self-made bullcrap titles? Who the hell are you to bash anyone. You are just an arm-chair quarterback who thinks he is the God of the kickboxing World! You are a clueless loser!!!!!

PS. F..k U...

Actually Goofy - I have fought quite a few times about 15 years ago and had a fight in Thailand about 8 months ago. What claims do I have? Well, no I haven't won any titles. I have however travelled all over the world and trained with some great name fighters. The thing is though, I have never claimed to be something I'm not. Anytime I fought I was known as being a fighter and not a pussy who ran or gave up. I'd rather win by taking the fight to someone or just take a beating like a man than punk out. I am hardly a armchair quarterback.

Now - I didn't BASH him at all. I just don't like him from what I see and don't like him nearly as much as you do. Read the fucking thread! He hasn't fought in 4 years and he is still the IKF champion? With all due respect to Alexio and the IKF, I'm sorry but they seem to be the only ones who feel it's ok to keep a title when you don't actively fight.

Once again you babbling fucking idiot - I never have said he was a poor fighter or lacked skills or that he sucked. If you read what I said - I have continuely praised his skills.

Have him DEFEND his title if he's going to keep it or have another person take his place! That is only fair. Get it thru your thick skull - Whether he can or could beat someone at this point means nothing unless he fights them. This has nothing to do with the career he has had or if I like him! Got it, get it, GOOD!

Go give Alexio a blowjob - you might feel better.

Alexio was the man in FC there is no doubt.
He did sure have talent but I completly started disliking him after his comments after his loss to Stan.
Rockhard is right about IKF, it is nonsence to have a inactive champ.

y does someone have to be a fighter before they can give an opinion about a sport?that is so stupid.
goofy,
y r u getting mad?because someone does not share your views?you r allowed to like alexio.we are allowed to not like him.u think he's great,we think he's ok.get over it.

Its ok to hat esomeone. But to keep putting him down because of not fighting to people you want him to fight is crazy! So he didnt fight Hoost or Aerts or Smith or whoever else is out there you want him to fight. The point is, he fought and won in grand fashion. He was an exciting fighter to watch and I enjoyed that aspect. Don't blame Alexio for still holding the IKF title. You have to ask the IKF about that. I just get mad when people bash someone who's been there and done that. You keep saying until he fights....Well guess what . He aint fighting those guys. His career is probably over. So judge him on what he's done, not on what he coulda,woulda,shoulda done!

Dude - It is you are missing the fucking point.

Answer these questions and only these:

How have I put him down or bashed him?

Did I say I hate him?

Didnt' I say I enjoyed watching him and found his fights exciting?

Am I still an armchair quarterback?

I'll answer that on - No, I'm definitely not.

Have I denied that he was a skilled and talented fighter?

Am I allowed to say I don't fucking like the guy and I don't think he is NEARLY as good as you think he is?

What the fuck are you so angry about?

Please answer those questions as it seems your head is so far up your ass that it's preventing YOU from seeing the light!

I prefer Don Wilson and Rob Kaman to Alexio - Can I say that without you getting pissed?

You can say whatever you want to say. I liked Alexio because he had great hands and kicks. You trashed him as a 600 punder with daily bedpan privileges in your first post. You started the thread with Alexio bashing. So don't blame me. I just just ran with your thread.

Answer the questions GOOFY. Why don't you do that instead of whining about my opinion? Or do you lack the ability to think? Sure seems like it.....

Like I asked - what are you so angry about? You're angry that there are too many champions, you're angry that nobody here likes Alexio as he is an asshole, you're angry when I ask constructive questions......why don't you stop being angry and start thinking critically?! It's simple - I DONT LIKE HIM AND THINK HE'S A PRICK! That doesn't mean he isn't a good fighter - Got it yet? Has that brain started working or is it still up your sphincter?

You are the one who started whining about my opinion. I could'nt care a rats ass who you hate. Stick with the facts. You claim Alexio will never be regarded until he fights so and so. I said, I liked watching his fights and since he is never going to fight these guys unless he a gets a big payday. Your point is worthless. PS: Fly me to Thailand. Pay my expenses. And pay me a U.S $10,000 purse and I would love to fight you. We are the same age and weight. Now, if you don't agree to my request. Do I then bash you for not fighting me. If the money was right, Alexio would have loved to fight your top fighters. Money talks. PS: I want first-class airfare and a rental car.

Whatever, We all saw how great Alexio was against the mighty Tong Po!!!
The thai ppl described alexio as that pitiful dog who lost so miserably to the mighty TONG PO!!! (lol)
then Van damme came along and kicked tong pos ass!
isnt dennis alexio still in a wheelchair from what tong po did to him?

But Van damme was a champion kickboxer and guess what?
HE STILL IS !!!
HA HA HA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!1
HOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOO
HAAAAAAAAAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAA

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

SOMEONE HELP ME
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

THE END

P.s.
Van damme told maah lee to cut the ropes then he did this jump spinning kick thatwas so fast that they had to slow the camera down and repeat it so many times.

THE REEL END !
(Fooled you guys the first time)

On the way back to the airport , Van Damme, tong po and maah lee were shot by tong po and killed until they were dead

THE MISERABLE END !
(yeah its for real this time)
Bye now!

oh guys , dont fight please, lets all smoke a spliff and get high together

see ya

Yea....like I'm gonna pay you $10,000 so I can have the priviledge of fighting you? I got a better idea - Pay for your own first class ticket and rental car and do it for free! How's that?

Yea....like I'm gonna pay you $10,000 so I can have the priviledge of fighting you? I got a better idea - Pay for your own first class ticket and rental car and do it for free! How's that?

Hey Goofy - Isn't it time for you to go give Alexio a hummer?

Guys, lay off the insults and stick to the points.

Alexio started fighting in 1981 under his real name of "Dennis Dick" if I'm not mistaken. Alexio is his mother's name. He fought a great leg-kick fight against Don Wilson in 1984 which was aired on network TV. He lost the fight, but only had something like 6 fights to Wilson's 50 plus. He went on to win the PKA lightheavyweight title that same year from a guy from Chicago, but his name escapes me at the moment. He was probably the most explosive full-contact fighter I ever saw and had excellent hands. I'm sure that if he would have had the opportunities in Muay Thai, he would have adapted quite well. If you get a chance to see his fights from the 80's, you would agree that he had the potential to be a very good international-rules fighter.

I do agree....

Oh yea, my Dads bigger than your Dad. I would have to say the "ice man" would have to be the most explosive, especially when it comes to consequtive KO's. how does their records stack up in this regard. If I remember I think Jean Eves went close to fifty in a row, and yes I know he as not a heavyweight. The good old days of the PKA. It brings a tear to my eye remembering, Bad Brad, James Waring, Rick the Jet and even that twit Joe Corley.

Donald, I think I agree with you there. Jean Yves definately had the moves and his punches and kicks were total text book boxing and full-contact. Boy, those were the days......remember that young rascal Rick Roufus that did all those crazy kicks?

Donald, I think I agree with you there. Jean Yves definately had the moves and his punches and kicks were total text book boxing and full-contact. Boy, those were the days......remember that young rascal Rick Roufus that did all those crazy kicks?

OK Boys... Enough fighting about all this.
To respond to some of the issues, instead we will ask some simple questions.
We will respond in UPPERCASE to easier separate the questions from the answers. It's not YELLING...

Mainly directed to Rockhard from his wondering thoughts;

Rockhard Asked:

1) How long will Alexio be the champion under your rules before his title is vacated as nobody has challenged him?

IKF RESPONSE;
WE WILL DO "THE RIGHT THING" WHICH IS, ALLOW HIM TO KEEP HIS TITLE UNTIL SOMEONE CHALLENGES HIM AND THERE IS A PURSE ISSUE OR UNTIL HE OFFICIALLY RETIRES HIS TITLE. "THIS" IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. HE'S NOT "HURTING" ANYONE BY REMAINING CHAMPION... THIS IS THE SIMPLE FACT HERE. HOWEVER, IF CHALLENGED FROM A FIGHTER WHO HAS A PROMOTER LINED UP TO PROMOTE THE BOUT AND PAY ALL THE PURSES, I DOUBT DENNIS WOULD REFUSE, UNLESS THE PURSE OFFER WAS A JOKE. AT THAT POINT, THE IKF BOARD WOULD DETERMINE WHAT IS A FAIR PURSE OFFER AND WHY.

Rockhard Asked:
2) Champions fight and want to fight. From my limited knowledge, it does not seem like he wants to fight or he might already be fighting some of the big names today. He is not. Not only that but it seems like boxing DOES have the right idea having people be 'forced' as you put it into fighting every year. They shouldn't have to be forced if they are a true champion and most fighters fight at the very least 1-2x per year.

IKF RESPONSE;
DENNIS "DID THIS". HE PROMOTED AS MANY AS 4-6 TIMES A YEAR IN HAWAII, BUT NO ONE EVER OFFERED HIM A BOUT. IT WAS ALWAYS, "PAY ME TO FIGHT ON YOUR SHOW DENNIS". AFTER "SEVERAL" YEARS OF DOING THIS, HE JUST GOT TIRED OF DOING IT... ANYONE WOULD WOULD. DENNIS PROMOTED HIS OWN EVENTS MORE THAN "ANY" CHAMPION WE KNOW OF PAST OR PRESENT. BET YOU WEREN'T AWARE OF THIS WERE YOU...


Rockhard Asked:
3) Boxing's organizations are indeed a joke but they don't allow the fighters to lay idle as champions for numerous years without ever fighting. A fighter who is a champion needs to fight...Bernard Hopkins fought for years making small purses before he finally made it with the Trinidad fight.

IKF RESPONSE;
YOUR MISSING THE POINT HERE "STILL". "WHO, OTHER THAN THE PROMOTERS OF THE LONGINIDIS VS ALEXIO FIGHT, HAS OFFERED DENNIS A FIGHT IN THE LAST 5 YEARS ON AN EVENT NOT IN HAWAII... LET US ANSWER FOR YOU,,, "NO ONE!" HOPKINS "DID" GET OFFERED FIGHTS. HOW DO WE KNOW THIS? HOPKINS "IS NOT" A PROMOTER.

Rockhard Asked:
4) I never have liked Alexio personally from what I have seen of him but a) that doesn't mean if I knew him I would feel that way and b) nor do I deny that he was very talented and c) what I think about him really doesn't matter as it doesn't affect his skill level. I am not disputing that he was very talented.

IKF RESPONSE;
WE AGREE.

Rockhard Asked:
5) Perhaps I am wrong but while I understand you don't wish to force anyone to pay sanctioning fees, shouldn't you FORCE the top rated contender and the champion to fight? I mean, if they can't agree on the purse, then shouldn't it go to a purse bid or is that too optomistic?

IKF RESPONSE;
ROCKHARD, AGAIN, YOU ARE MISSING THE "SIMPLE FACT" HERE. "WHO SHOULD PROMOTE A FIGHT? WHO SHOULD PAY DENNIS AND AN OPPONENT? DO YOU "TRULY" THINK HOPKINS WOULD HAVE PROMOTED HIS OWN SHOWS ALL THOSE YEARS? OF COURSE NOT. "NO" BOXER HAS! NONE!! SO WHY SHOULD WE "EXPECT" KICKBOXING CHAMPIONS TO DO WHAT BOXING CHAMPIONS DO WHEN THE ISSUES ARE "VERY" DIFFERENT!? HERE'S ONE FOR YOU, IF "YOU" PERSONALLY FEEL DENNIS RETAINING HIS TITLE IS SUCH A BIG ISSUE AND SUCH A TERRIBLE THING FOR THE IKF TO ALLOW, WHY DON'T YOU PROMOTE THE FIGHT? OK, NOT TRYING TO BE A JERK HERE, IT'S JUST THE REALITY OF IT ALL. REGARDLESS OF "PURSE AMOUNTS", THE FACT IS, "WHO" WANTS TO PROMOTE IT?

Rockhard Asked:
While I understand the intent of the IKF and feel it is trying to do side with the fighter and not income, I can't understand the logic of - NO ONE has made any formal challenge towards Dennis so he will remain champion until he is challenged and loses. What is that?

IKF RESPONSE;
AGAIN, WHAT DON'T YOU GET???? WHAT DO "YOU" EXPECT US TO DO? IF NO ONE IS CHALLENGING HIM, IT MUST MEAN NO ONE ELSE WANTS THE TITLE MAYBE? OR, NO ONE WANTS TO FIGHT HIM. EVER THINK OF THAT? HEY, LETS BE HONEST HERE. WE ASKED FIGHTERS LIKE MAURICE SMITH AND OTHERS IF THEY WOULD FIGHT DENNIS, OF COURSE ALL SAID YES. NEXT WE ASKED, "WOULD YOU FIGHT HIM IN FULL CONTACT RULES?" SURPRISE... "ALL" SAID NO! "UNLESS" THE MONEY WAS RIGHT. SO YOU SEE, IT'S NOT JUST DENNIS, ASK ANY OF YOUR K-1 FIGHTERS IF THEY WOULD FIGHT DENNIS UNDER "FULL CONTACT RULES?" AND WE BET NO ONE WOULD CHANGE OVER FOR HIM, SO WHY DO YOU FEEL HE NEDS TO CHANGE FOR THEM? IT'S "TWO TOTALLY DIFFERENT RULE STYLES!!!" IS MICHAEL JORDAN A CHUMP AND A LOSER BECAUSE HE DIDN'T PLAY PROFESSIONAL FOOTBALL? DON'T YOU GET THIS???

Rockhard Asked:
You are the sanctioning body, why don't you mandate that he defends his title?

IKF RESPONSE;
OK, WE WILL. AND WE ASK YOU TO PROMOTE IT AND PAY THE PURSES. "SEE WHERE THIS BECOMES COMPLICATED?" WHY SHOULD WE "FORCE" ANYONE TO DO ANYTHING? FIGHTERS, PROMOTERS, TRAINERS... WHY? FOR MONEY?? SORRY, NOT OUR STYLE.

Rockhard Asked:
I just don't believe that a champion can sit on his ass for 4 years and still keep his title. Is that right or wrong? In my eyes, money or not, sanctioning fees or not, he needs to defend his title.

IKF RESPONSE;
AGAIN, WHAT WE, THE IKF IS DOING IN THIS CASE "IS" THE RIGHT THING TO DO! NO DOUBT ABOUT THIS. ANY OTHER OPTION, WITHOUT ANOTHER PROMOTER STEPPING UP MEANS MONEY OUT OF "THE CHAMPIONS" POCKET. "WHY" WOULD WE CHOOSE TO DO SUCH A TERRIBLE THING TO "ANY" FIGHTER.


And for the record, Longinidis did not retire Dennis. He won his IKF Title and "SEVERAL" more fights after the Longinidis fight. What Stan may have done was keep Dennis from fighting leg kicks again. HOWEVER, we ask again, WHO of all these leg kick fighters will fight Dennis in full contact rules? VERY FEW. So WHY should we expect Dennis to jump into their ring under their rules. Hey, he tried it, didn't do as good as he wished, end of story. He played their game, lets see some of them play his.

We do know one person who would give Dennis a GREAT Full Contact Rules fight, RICK ROUFUS! Lets hope someone opens their eyes and makes this possible, for it may already be too late...

I think Dennis put his foot in his mouth by stating he was a leg kick fighter and bagging some guys for not wanting to fight him with legkicks. That is difference IKF Kickboxing. One cannot just say well lets see them fight him with above waist kicks, because I'm sure they all had no interest or inclination to. They were International Rules fighters. Why take a step back? Andfight for what I am sure would have been peanuts ofered to them. Alexio, however, also fancied himelf a leg kicker too and bagged people who didn't. And he did have quite a few low kick contests apparently. That is the important difference.

Nice post Stevie:

You drove your point home.

One thing I need to correct you on is your comment:
IKF RESPONSE;
YOUR MISSING THE POINT HERE "STILL". "WHO, OTHER THAN THE PROMOTERS OF THE LONGINIDIS VS ALEXIO FIGHT, HAS OFFERED DENNIS A FIGHT IN THE LAST 5 YEARS ON AN EVENT NOT IN HAWAII... LET US ANSWER FOR YOU,,, "NO ONE!"

Actually Nasser Niavaroni (uppercut promotions) promoted Dennis vs. Roger Achillo on May 1, 1998 in Sacramento California.

This is a dead thread.
You either loved or hated Dennis. He was a great kickboxer, showman (talked allot of crap) & great for the sport (kinda the Mohammad Ali of kickboxing).
Dennis won't get in the ring again unless he gets mucho $$$$$$. I don't see anyone risking that kind of money on a 40+ year old who hasn't fought in 4 years. So I think you have seen the last of Alexio.

I do think it would be benificial to the sport if his IKF title would be vacated (somehow, up to you Steve to figure that one out) so we can get some new blood fighting for that title & add some more excitement to the sport.

You gotta admit that Alexio was the BEST businessman/kickboxer we have seen yet. As Stevie put it:

DENNIS "DID THIS". HE PROMOTED AS MANY AS 4-6 TIMES A YEAR IN HAWAII, BUT NO ONE EVER OFFERED HIM A BOUT. IT WAS ALWAYS, "PAY ME TO FIGHT ON YOUR SHOW DENNIS". AFTER "SEVERAL" YEARS OF DOING THIS, HE JUST GOT TIRED OF DOING IT...ANYONE WOULD. DENNIS PROMOTED HIS OWN EVENTS MORE THAN "ANY" CHAMPION WE KNOW OF PAST OR PRESENT.

Adirtykid

When I say Stevie I am refering to IKF Steve Fossum not Stevos. Just for the record.

Adirtykid

This thread has indeed run it's course and I hav said throughout the thread, I don't think anyone is disputing his talent.

First though Stevie - I'm not a promoter so why would I want to promote an Alexio fight?

Second - While boxing is very different from full contact, if a champion doesn't get the money he wants for his defense, then whichever, if any, promoters wish to promote the fight go to a purse bid.

Now if there isn't one promoter who is now or was willing in 1999 to promote an Alexio fight (beside's himself) then the sport was and is in much worse shape then I thought. I don't doubt that but it is a sad thing when you have a champion like Alexio who cant defend his title because nobody is willing to put up at least the IKF's minimum purse.

I final thought - Don't you think it would be better to have an active champion instead of one who hasn't fought in 4 years? I mean - Even Ali got stripped of his title......I understand the lack of promoters with funds puts you in a tough spot but if you are going to sanction bouts and make champions, then shouldn't you find a way to make sure the champions fight?

rockhard credit where its deserved has been mentioned above THIS is MY Fav: saying !
You have done the do yourself like me too ! CREDIT !
Dennis has done his fights in HIS style ! CREDIT ( i dont prefer those rules at all ! like you ! and i do sometimes admit to calling it a bit NONCEY ) BUT thats his style fair enough !
You had a REAL go at GOOF and its no wonder he attacked back ! why go into foul mouthed attacks on him? I DONT know goof ? who he is ? or where from ? so its not about fav: But it has got too much to keep using strong offensive language too someones oppinions ! like a few yanks your quick to shoot off ! Learn to chill a bit !

Well said Sandy.

Well, good point anyway. I don't know if it was 'well said'

:-)

it would be near impossible for dennis to get a well paying fight now because he is limited to above waist fights,
wether this is because the injury he suffered from stan made him gun shy of getting kicked in the legs again or he simply can't fight international rules leg kicks wether he wants to or not because of the steel rod in his leg...i have no idea, but being limited to a dying and not overly deep style (as it is these days) you unfortunately have to conclude that dennis stopped being significant many years ago,
the fact that he still demands astronomical purses, and as adirtykid perfectly said, which promoter can afford to pay him that for a 40 plus yo who only now fights above waist and hasn't fought in years,
indeed alexio is now the past. a shame for those that remember the old days, everything moves on!

just a question, since the bout with stan in 1992 i believe alexio hasn't ONLY fought in hawaii has he? i am sure he fought in canada and the states as well.

Doug - the fighter from Chicago that you mentioned is Rob Salazar.

Hey Lee:
Like I said in my earlier post. Dennis fought Roger Achillo on May 1, 1998 in Sacramento California. He fought in Cananda on pay per view before the Stan fight. If I remember correctly, I believe he fought Kimber. It was on the undercard fight of Jean Yves vs. somebody (have tape, but can't remember). Please correct me if I am wrong here about the Canada fight, I'm too buzzed to remember where the tape is at & all the details.

Anyways,Dennis was so pissed that he was not the main event in Canada that he almost didn't take that fight. But I guess the $ was right. We have the belt from the Kimber fight hanging in the gym.

Hey dirtykid where in Canada do u train at?

Actually Dnamo I train in Sacramento Califoria. Nasser Niavaroni (Alexio's ex-trainning partner & cornerman) has a great gym. The website is www.kickboxinginc.com

Just wondering.....
When we see comments like;

"dying and not overly deep style"

About Full Contact Rules kickboxing, it makes us think the people who say these things don't get out much...
It's obvious that the majority of the posting individuals here favor MuayThai, but how many here are really fighters, promoters and trainers? And of them, how many truly get around the world "In Person" to see what's really happening?

Those with these comments seem to only know about K-1, which is understandable since it, as a promotion, is paying the best purses today, and what you guys have seen on the ESPN shows in the past few years. However, what you don't see is what is "Really" going on around the world as a whole.

1: To begin with, the ESPN thing, Keep in mind that the reason we were told why ratings slipped over the past 5 years and why you don't see a lot of kickboxing on TV now is because those with the deal were doing less and less FCR style fighting. When the promoter was doing FCR, those ratings were a lot higher. This is not "Our" opinion, this was a fact shown to us.

2: At our (IKF) USA National Amateur Tournament, FCR has always outnumbered both MuayThai (MTR) and International Rules (IR) every single year for the last 4 years. In some years, IR & MTR together did not equal the total number of FCR Fighters.

3: At this years National Tournament, In the JUNIOR divisions, the future of our sport here in the USA anyway (Ages 8-17) we had 71 Junior fighters in FCR. However the total number of fighters in IR & MTR was "12".

4: At this years National Tournament, in the Adult Divisions, we had a total of 122 Adult fighters (Men & Women). Of them, 69 were in FCR, 26 in IR and 27 in MTR.

5: In Europe, as many can verify, there is a more even mix of FCR, IR and MTR, however, MTR & IR are NOT leading by any means. FCR is VERY Strong in Europe as well.

6: The only area we see very little FCR is in central Canada and Australia. However in Western and Eastern Canada we have a lot of FCR action. In Australia, although we have had FCR action, the leader there seems to be International Rules.

7: In Asia, we have had a mixture of all styles again, in fact, one of the largest World Title fights in Asia was in Malaysia, and it was a FCR World Title fight with GREAT Purses for BOTH fighters.

8: In Central Europe, an organization known as WAKO is very successful there. The main rule style they sanction? Full COntact.


This is not an advertisment for FCR. We're not saying we like FCR better either as some would think. Our job as a sanctioning organization is to support and feature all rule styles equally and we believe we do a very good job of this because ALL Fighters in ALL Styles deserve this.

So with this being said, lets remember, if we want our sport to grow we must treat all our styles fair. Like the saying goes in Martial Arts, "There is no right or wrong way, better or worse way, only different."

Thanks for the info Steve:

I totally agree with you.

But yes the facts speak for themselves. I am glad you brought this up as when I was checking you list of fighters for your national tournament I noticed all the FC fighters that were signed up & was very pleasantly suprised.

Personally I enjoy FC more as there is very little clinching & hugging, which results in more action. There have also been some great MT fights that I have seen, so many times (as with any style) it all depends on the fighters. I can also see the general public liking FC more as there is more combinations. When the public looks at MT, the sport appears more violent with leg kicks & knees. I don't think the average joe is understanding of this type of violence.
This is just my opinion , and I know I will get heat from this post, so go ahead cuz I am expecting it.

You also see all these martial arts schools all over the place with lots of kids taking classes. IMO, I believe that the parents don't want there children watching the kickboxing shows (especially MT) as they are too violent. The parents are too brainwashed with the wimpy point sparring which is fantasy land fighting.

BTW, when my son gets old enough I plan on teaching him MT & grappling to deal with "real world" street defense.

Adirtykid

Its very simple. Fighting Full-Contact is much harder than fighting leg-kick or Muay Thai. Full-Contact require great hands/feet. More skill to be able to land the head and spinning kicks. This is why Full-Contact is so much more exciting. To see athletes do the impossible. That is what "sells" the public. Anyone can kick the leg. Heck my 90 year grandma can kick you in the leg. Big F-----ing deal! I don't want to see two guys doing half-assed boxing and throwing an occasional leg kick. Muay Thai is even more boring. Half the fight is clinching and wrestling. BORING!!! FC has always sold better and has always recieved higher ratings. This is not my opinion, this is pure fact!

I think I got it!!!!!!! Goof's real identity is Bill Wallace!!!
I say this because I have not heard such opinions since the last time I read one of Wallace's column's in BB magazine!!!! :)

it's one thing when u give an opinion,it's another when u just talk shit.
i have fought both,and fc is not harder than mt.
and if it was so damn grand why did it die?you can't give it away on tv these days.
and it is nice when you see spinning kicks and what not but most can't pull them off with any accuracy. ask rick roufus,who is one of the best fc of all time,if leg kicks are easy, and have no skill involved.

Shit, I just now clicked this thread remembering that Dennis had been paralyzed in an accident in thailand. I guess he has recovered. Sounds like he has even fought again. Cheers to Dennis on his recovery.

So Leg-kicking is as hard or harder than kicking someone in the head. You can teach any non-athlete, chain smoking slob, to kick someone in the legs. Hell, you dont even have to teach them. Face it. The growth of the leg-kickers is pure and simple. Its so damn easy. It take skill and a lot of training to kick to the head and make it look easy. I stand by my opinion. Leg-kickers are too lazy to learn how to kick properly. Roufus is the exception. He started as a Full-contact fighter. He does leg-kick fights now, for the opportunity to fight often. But his fights are exciting, because he know how to kick. He kicks the leg, the head, and anywhere he wants, because of his FC background! That is why Roufus fights are so exciting. If leg-kickers would take the time to learn how to kick above the belt. Their fights would be so much better.

It seems most involved in the sport are old school & still hold on too FC & full contact Karate. FC is limited to the states while large kickboxing nations have moved on. Sorry but the days of the facny flick kick do not seem bright.

"Its very simple. Fighting Full-Contact is much harder than fighting leg-kick or Muay Thai. Full-Contact require great hands/feet. More skill to be able to land the head and spinning kicks."

what a stupid statement, old school FC still in the stone age. So called instructors here in OZ say Muay Thai is the easiest fighting art to learn ???? As my trainer says BULLSHIT. Thats why we all can kick like Sackmongkol!! YEAH RIGHT. Another example of a stupid uneducated statement like Goofs.

The US hasn't caught onto Muay Thai or leg kicks because it is scrappy & of poor standard, the only quality fights u see r imported fighters and a small minority of the local guys.

Umm, I'd recommend a bit more subtle formulation of views to prevent each other from attacking the other's exaggerations instead of the views themselves - which I feel happens here.

Yea but my brothers bigger than your brother

Kickboxing has degenerated to Boxkicking. All hands, poor at that and a few leg kicks. You might as well just Box. This is pretty much all I see in the leg kick fights. Muay Thai is the worse. Lousy hands, non-stop clinching and that boring as hell waikru crap they do before the fight starts. Kickboxing is now a joke! Still love the fights from the 80's.

I've seen a number of crappy FC fights! Almost all boxing, and the occasional roundhouse thrown as an excuse. We've discussed on AX before how the mandatory kicks rule often used for FC fights came to be: we theoretized there were a lot of fighters fighting mostly with their hands -> making boxing out of kickboxing, just as you suggest above. I don't think legkick fights would be much different (read: worse) in this sense.

I think your taste is simply different from what is popular nowadays.

I personally don't like the waikhru (sp?) either, my mindset is more 'western' in this respect, but I understand it's important to the fighter who does it and respect it when they do it. Please don't be so exaggerated.

As for MT, I can only say, it's a matter of taste: some people like vanilla ice, some like chocolate. Some people like american football, some like soccer, and some rugby.

It would be a boring world if we would all agree in everything and everyone liked the same things :). The trick is to have an open mind, and respect other's views and stance on life.

I agree Andras. When the public goes as a first time observer to a Kickboxing show. It would be nice if they saw some great, effective kicks! Usually it ends up looking like a bad toughman contest....

Well then I don't think what should be attacked is legkick rules or MT rules, but instead less than good fights.

I agree. I started counter-bashing after reading Rockhards posts. I like all good fights, regardless of style!

Oh, I'm sad to read the verbal attacks too. Let's hope next time everyone manages to say what they _mean_. :)

GOOF,
u obviously haven't seen alot of leg kick fights,or real mt fights.
there are very good kickers in both.steve vick was a tremendous kicker in the leg kick rules.sakmongkol,as some one said earlier,is a kicking machine.
and there is a skill to throwing leg kicks.throwing them wrong can lessen your power or even get yourself hurt.
and it really doesn't matter if leg kicks r easy to throw or not,what matters is effectiveness.the jab is the most simple punch,yet it is highly effective.should it be shit canned because of it's simplicity?no,because throwing a jab maybe simple but using it properly is another story.same goes with leg kicks.
and these fights do include high,and mid kicks as well as low kicks.ask jean claude leuyer,james warring,mike bernardo,sam greco,or mark hunt if there are no high kicks in k-1,or mt.

i suggest you look at finding a tape trader and see what's out there.

The Goof already said he likes all good fights, regardless of style.

This is dirtykid favorite subject, I knew I'd see him here!! hahaha. Well I was in Hawaii a while back and surprised to hear some non kickboxing people saying some bad things about Alexio. About how his opponents go down too easy and they saw these opponents eating chili dogs before the fight and stuff like that. I thought that was funny. They said the shit, I didn't bring it up. Now is it cuz Alexio was just dominating against everyone who fought him in Hawaii or any other reasons?

Hey, just a question dirtykid. I can already see you getting upset. Breathe, my friend. Relax a bit before you type anything. hahaha.

Hey legkick,
What up? Yah, you can always catch me in a Alexio thread. You know me too well. What took you so long to post though?

You really underestimated me this time. I am suppose to care about what a bunch of Hawaiian non-kickboxing fans say about Alexio and his opponents? How is that suppose to upset me? Better luck next time. lol

Adirtykid

Their are great fights in all styles. But the majority of fights I see, are not that great or even good! If we want to sell Kickboxing as a major sport. Its very simple: "We need great kickers!".

yeah but when u bashed anyone it seemed to be from legkick rules or mt.

and u only list fc fighters as being great kickers of the past.

Sorry about the onesideness. I do love Full-Contact the best. I think they kick better. lEGKICKERS mainly go to the legs. A few do alternate between the leg and head. These ones I like. But in a 5-12 round fight, I want to see more than just one high kick per round. I love watching guys get kicked in the head. This sells the sport to me. I know I will see more head kicks in a FC fight, rather than a legkick one. This is why I love to watch Rick Roufus. Whether he is fighting FC or legkicks. He always throws beautiful high kicks!

Goof you are living in the past...This ain't the 80's and all the wishing in the world won't take us back there...Want excitement? Go see a world class Muay Thai bout or better yet - Go to Lumpini stadium.

Full contact is hardly deep. If it were, why would the IK rankings have guys with 1 or 2 fights, both losses, ranked? Why would there be so many empty slots? Sorry......in my opinion if you can keep your champions for 4 years or 10 years without them ever fighting, something is seriously wrong and needs to be changed!

Full-Contact is big. The IKF is one organization. Steve even said he would not strip Alexio if noone challenged him, or if the purses were subpar. Did you even have any fights? How many? I think you got your ass kicked by a FC fighter and have a major chip on your shoulder!

Please guys, don't get personal. Focus on the issue and the discussion.

Goof - You are the one with this big full contact chip on your shoulder. Other people, namely me, are entitled to their own opinions and if you don't like them, well, like I said - TOUGH SHIT!

Address this one point:

I never said full contact wasn't big. WHY if full contact is so deep does the IKF have guys with 1 or 2 fights, both losses, ranked??? Why are their rankings without people in it? As far as keeping a champion for over 4 years when he hasn't fought - This just will never fly with me. His title should be vacated. There are plenty of fighters, boxing or otherwise who are not getting what they want. This is the fight game.

I answer to your question - YES - I have fought quite a few times (in total over 100) about 15-20 years ago and in Thailand also. My last fight was in Thailand 8 months ago. In case you don't know, I had a serious accident where I fell about 12 metres about 6 months ago. I broke at least 10 bones in my body and was in the hospital for 3 weeks and in a coma for 4 days. So - the fact that yes, I have been in the ring and that I am still living does make me a fighter pal. I never said I was world class but yes, I've fought and I'm a fighter all the way. I've trained with some world class fighters and respect them all the way for what they go thru and what it takes to get where they are. I never said I don't respect Alexio - I said I don't like him. MY OPINION!

Frankly speaking - You will never change how I feel about full contact. I have always liked it but I prefer Muay Thai. End of story. It seems like you will never change your thinking either so this arguing back and forth seems pretty pointless now......

Just so nobody gets the wrong idea - Most of the fights were Amateur.......

again,why does he have to have fights to form an opinion on fights?

it's this simple.money makes it happen,but you put money into what the ppl want most.if full contact was still real popular the big promoters would be pushing it.
don't get me wrong,i'm even starting to like fc more.well i always have but it was lacking something.i was real impressed with the ama.fc fighters at the ikf tourney this year.i talked to mean mike labree for a lil while out there and we talked about the same thing.i think fc could do better if it were injected with a different attitude,different presentation.

the other thing about fc is that is was mishandled.they tried to develop superstars way too fast.the stars were bigger than the sport.the sport was being supported on a handful of fighters shoulders.when they moved on there was no one to pick it up.

and fc has to lose it's karate roots.if it wants to be bigger. i think mt will have to do the same thing with the wai kru to be big,but shouldn't be dropped for the sake of being big.

i had faith that k-1 was going to be the answer but i think they are going to mess up also.maybe the whole sport is just doomed. i don't know.

Rockhard...
since you clearly didn't take ANY TIME to "REALLY" look at the IKF Rankings, We will fill you in on a little FYI..

You said;
"If it were, why would the IK rankings have guys with 1 or 2 fights, both losses, ranked?"

Well, sorry to inform you but you are very wrong here!!
NO FIGHTER without a win has a "NUMBER" Ranking "ANYWHERE" in "ANY" of the IKF Rankings. It's clear you looked at someone elses rankings because any fighter with "NO WINS" to his record ALWAYS has an "X" Ranking. If you took the time to look closer you would have noticed this.

And as far as Champions not being challenged, believe it or not this happens in EVERY RULE STYLE and in EVERY ORGANIZATION! The "ONLY" time you see champions getting challenged is when they have a trainer that's also a promoter, and even than you don't see it too often. Ask Leg kick about Eric Regan for example or Dave Marinobel. Both Middleweight fighters and World Champions yet NO ONE has EVER Challenged either of them for their titles. Think this is only true in Full Contact?? Take some more time to research this before stating what you fee l is fact. Better yet, we'll help you. Look at this page and see when these World Champions won their title and you will notice than very few of them were ever challenged for the title once they won it;

http://www.ikfkickboxing.com/IKFMPWChampions.htm

Now of course this is just the IKF. At least we tell everyone when a fighter won their World Title. NO other organization even offers that, EVEN MUAYTHAI Organizations!

What MuayThai or Leg Kick Champions won a World title and have NEVER been challenged for it?? PLENTY. Heck, we'll just do the research for you;


MTR: Enn Fairtex of Fairtex USA/Thailand, never challenged

MTR, IR, FCR: 3 Time World Champion Ali Hallak of Australia, never challenged

MTR: Vasily Shish of Belarus, never challenged

MTR & IR: 2 Time World Champion Danny Steele of USA, never challenged

FCR: Paul Biafore of Canada, never challenged

MTR: Khunpon of USA/Thailand, never challenged

MTR: Matee Jedeepitak of USA/Thailand, never challenged

MTR: Vladimir Autamonov of Russia will defend his title for the first time this Fall.

IR: Fernando Calleros of USA, never challenged

MTR: Dmitry Shakuta of Belarus, never challenged

FCR: Anthony Bartinelli was scheduled to defend two weeks ago but an injury pulled him out of the fight

MTR: Kongnapa defended against Shakuta and won, retired his title, and came back at a heavier weight and won, has yet to ever be challenged for it.

FCR: Dave Marinoble of USA, never challenged

Rudi Ott of USA just won an IKF San Shou World Title 2 weeks ago.

San Shou: Cung Le of USA, never challenged

MTR: Chris Wright of England, won IKF, ISKA and WKA World titles, has yet to be challenged for ANY.

FCR: Dennis Alexio, you know the story here.

FCR & IR: Rick Roufus of USA, never challenged

MTR: Duke Roufus of USA, retired having never been "Challenged" but did promote an event to defend it.

MTR: Matt Skelton of England, defended his title once with success.


So WHY have they not been challenged, or so few? Go back to the thread that talks about "Whats the Point"
http://message.axkickboxing.com/index?action=dispthread&topic=5431&junk=1031419506.17822

The main reason is, most want to win a title but don't want to challenge someone who's already won one. They would rather fight someone who's not won a World Title hoping they would get an easier fight. And with all the ABC backyard organizations out there, we all see this is exactly what is happening with our sport... So SAD, but true...

And again, this is not just in the IKF, look at ALL the organizations, 80% of their World Champions have never been challenged let alone promote a defense, ESPECIALLY the Heavyweight and Super Heavyweight fighters who are doing K-1. At least our IKF world MTR World Champion Matt Skelton has defended his IKF World Title once and won.

I have to say ! after defending goof a long way up on here ! That i was a little PUT out by some scathing remarks from where i POSTED the
"OOPS" remark ! as i didnt like what was wrote !
IMO only i think that FC was a thing of the 80's and at its BEST THEN yes !!!! "BUT" and as someone put above ( sorry who was it ? Rockhard ? or Kirk? ) re: it WAS the 80's and its NOT now ! is ALSO "TRUE"
as Kickboxing and MUAY-THAI have overtaken it somewhat ! and now there is the MMA currently running a close second alongside muay-thai ! NOT i might add in competition ! BUT as an ALLIE ( anyone go with that ???????????? )
OUR country u.k. did not get MUAY-THAI till 1977 but f.c. was already here from about 1970 ish ! In fact id stick my neck out and say the WORLD didnt start getting muay-thai till the 1970 even 1980's !! so FC style would have been more popular ! It is a shame but sorry to say without being disrespectfull ! over here and in many parts of the WORLD ( am i right in saying ??? ) its becoming a bit of a Dinosaur ! ITS had its hey day/s ! IMO anyone agree ??
cheers WITH RESPECT sandy man holt

A well-known muay thai guy recently said to me that he wanted to promote muay thai and that people who do full-contact or leg kick rules or even san shou rules could all learn things from muay thai that would benefit them in their own particular style. He was respectful of the different styles. He even said he didn't think he would do good at full-contact rules. I think he probably would do very well at full contact rules, actually. But he was humble and seemed to just be interested in spreading his art of muay thai and helping out all styles of kickboxing.

I don't think one of the styles is gonna die unless the opportunities die. If the right promotions and opportunities come along for full-contact rules then that style may become more full of participants. All the big name heavies go for k1 cuz that has the exposure and respect and $$$. If there was a full contact promotion that offered $$ and respect and exposure then I think kickboxing athletes would go into that.

Dirtykid I am sorry to dissapoint you. I have let myself down. Will try harder next time.

Hey legkick,
No need to hang your head in shame. You are a formidable opponent & have not discrased yourself or your family.
Someday we need to get together & hang out.

Yah, I was digging on what you were saying legkick. If some big shot guy with lots of $$$ (say like Trump) decided he wanted to put on some big time full contact tournaments paying big bucks I think we all know what the big time fighters would do. They would learn how to box, sidekick & kick high.
Right now you got ISHI (or whatever his name is) with his money telling everyone that you should kick legs & clinch and use your knees. This is just a perfect example of how money can influence a sport. Fighters will follow the $$$$$, and I don't blame them. Another example of this is that we are loosing many great fighters to boxing cuz that is where the $$$ are at. Until we can get some decent paydays that these kickboxers can live off of, the sport won't grow.

Also legkick, you probably already heard. Gilbert Martinez (from Niavaroni's) will be fighting (boxing) Jeramy Williams Sept 29 on FSN. Pretty cool, huh?

Adirtykid

Kirk.
"again,why does he have to have fights to form an opinion on fights?"
Thank you.

IKF.
"but how many here are really fighters, promoters and trainers? And of them, how many truly get around the world "In Person" to see what's really happening?"
Thank you. Us fans eh, what are we like?

I think your kidding yourself about fighters not wanting to to fight champions. There are much more difficult fights out there than some of the IKF champions. The reason they are not challenged for their titles lies somewhere other than fear of the fighters you mentioned.

Rockhard.
I agree with you. How can a fighter have his title for 4 years and it not be vacated? Whatever the champion thinks he is worth, the reality is he is only worth what someone is willing to pay him.
Outpricing yourself just makes the title dead mans shoes.

Hey.. i got the 100'th post too.

I wish DEnnis would fight.He is a great fighter.I have fought both styles leg-kicks and full contact.Granted my last leg kick fight ended bad but it is still a great sport/.Tournaments need to be a little more regulated,if someone throws a cheap shot they should be out.But enough crying.I think everyone has their style just as there is football,rugby,australian rules.There is fc,mt san-shou mixed is one better than another I think if you ask 100 people you will get many different answers and many different reasons.Ithink DEnnis was a very smooth fluid fighter who was great to watch.As far as him talking leg kicks who knows just because Stan beat him does not mean he is not good.Stan has beaten many great fighters.Personally I think full-contact is a great sport as well as muay thai as well as boxing.They all have their place and as kickboxers we should do what we can to make them all grow.There are enough people who know nothing about kickboxing bashing it,the last thing we need is kickboxers bashing it.AS far as Dennis goes soon he will get a challenge i am sure he will take it or leave it.No matter what the decision he was and always be a great fighter

the money alone isn't the answer.the style has to be right.
if trump had the best doing point kickboxing,do you think it would sell?

it's the money(to draw the best fighters)and the right style(to draw the most ppl)that works.

Well full contact kickboxing was popular back in the day so it has been a proven commodity. Point kickboxing should not be compared with the other styles cuz it is not a full contact sport.

Dirtykid I will definitely be watching that fight. Gil will probably surprise Jeremy Williams. And some other people. He could be the next Chris Byrd. Hope he kicks some butt.

full contact was the shit,at one time.so were pet rocks and rubiks cubes.try selling them to someone.

2 reason why i think fc failed.too much too soon,and publics opinion on martial arts.think about it,at one time martial arts were considered cool.60's,70's,and 80's.now ppl view it as a joke.the movies that at one timed fueled the popularity now are watched for a laugh.

if ishii tried his format and it flopped he wouldn't keep trying it.you put your money where u think it's going to do the best. the guy is a kyokushin man.did you ever wonder why he didn't push kyokushin tourneys?because it wouldn't fly worldwide.no matter how much money he dumped in it.

IKF,

Didn't Andre McIntyre( Reading, GB) challenge Chris Wright for one of his titles?

I think I remember reading something about it on the Muay Thai Online!!

Hi Andy,
That could be true, however, we're sure the question would have been;

"Who would promote it?"

Again, many can say they challenge someone, but WHO will promote it?
1: Host and pay for the venue
2: Pay the purses
3: Pay this, pay that...

If it was a serious challenge, he would have had a promoter lined up to promote it. If your asking why wouldn't Wright promote it? Another easy one... WHY should he be asked or forced to pay for his own title defense? He shouldn't

Regardless of Rockhards views, the issue here is "MONEY". NOT Sanctioning money. In Wright's case for example, we offered to waive all sanctioning fees due to the IKF for a "3 Way World Title" between Wright and any other ISKA or WKA (The only other Worldwide organizations) World Champion a couple of years back. All we asked was the others do the same. The idea here was to unify the title, like the sport needs. However both refused so Wright's trainer actually promoted a WKA event just to get the title. It cost him a TON! Wright won so it was worth it to him. Now with all 3 World Titles, he still hasn't received a challenge. However, ISKA never listed him as a World Champion. Took the promoters money, called it a World Title, but the ISKA USA and ISKA Europe are not on the same page. One sanctioned it as a world Title (Europe) and the other acted as if it never happened. (USA) Go figure...

As far as our comment about why fighters are not challenging our IKF Champions, you misunderstood. We didn't say everyone was afraid to fight the IKF Champions, our point was, if a promoter can sanction a vacant World title from another organization (one of these local ones we've discussed) why not do it. It saves the promoter from paying for a fighter who has already proven him or herself. This is NOT just in the IKF, it's in EVERY Organization. This is just 1 example why so many other organizations have been created. But are they TRULY working FOR THE SPORT? Or are they just offering "Letters" and a title belt... You be the judge...

IKF,

Thanks for the reply ! It certainly seems to make sense !

Steve (IKF),

What's the latest on getting some IKF shows on ESPN?

Adirtykid

Hi adirtykid,
As they say in the answer section...

"There we have a Gray area..."

We've been talking with them and even had an offer from them, but the reality is, they just don't have a lot of program space to offer or fill.

There are several issues related to the talks we've had with them and the current Kickboxing programing as well. As much as we would all like to see Kickboxing as a regular program on a station like ESPN, the fact is, it may never happen. Especially now with NFL season coming up. If you notice, NFL has had a lot of air time with NFL specials etc... Can't blame them for pleasing the proven programs that bring them the top $$$.

We do know you will see IKF Kickboxing on ESPN, soon. It has nothing to do with money in case you may be thinking this. Heck, we'd do it for free just to get our sport on TV. It "NEEDS" This!
The main issue here is program space on ESPN and ESPN 2. There just isn't much available.

Regardless of the delays, we know it WILL Happen. We just hate talking about it until it's actually "In the can" as they say in filming"...

What we will also say though is "Don't forget the many other cable stations out there." We have several things in the mix and again we say, It WILL Happen...

Crazy how this thread started out as "Dennis Alexio" & has a bit of everything in it.....

Anyways,

Does anyone know the truth to the "Rumor" that there will be an ESPN 3, or a martial arts tv network?

Hey Brian and Andres,
We (at least me) need spellcheck (desperately) on this posting section. lol

adirtykid
Yes, there "WAS" Talk of this.
However, the story we heard was the chief parent company of ESPN and ABC (Owned by Disney I believe) lost too much last year (Due a lot to 9-11) that these plans were put on hold... At least, something like that...

ok you guys listen up ok cus im australian an we all know that australians kick ass as kickboxers an not that umm american above the waist world championship rubbush that only you guys do an call yourselves champs much like american football, baseball an umm whats that other thing??? ohh yeah american idol lol.I remember alexio turning up to fight stan in a goddam hula grass skirt looking like a $2 ho from jerry springer cus he thought it would cushion his thighs from stan the mans kicks... so stan broke his shin in 5 seconds into the first round.I rate dennis alexio as a great american above the waist fighter but thats about it was he a great international fighter well umm no he fought nobodys apart from don wilson an stan longinedis an he lost to them , he panicked against cikatic an fought dirty so umm yeh so his records impressive ???????????? well sos that fatass butterbean but all he ever beat were local yokel farmers from nebraska.
Am i taking the piss out of you guys well hell yes i am because it is so easy too lol an you know why i can ?? its cus im from australia the home of the k1 champion an play a real contact game ... rugby lol....
and if you dont see the fact im only joking than go an give me 100 high kicks on each legs on the pads .

as far as espn's coverage of kickboxing, i dont think they are being truthful
that there is no time. they have been showing the same old reruns of old
fights and those 2000 martial arts championships from orlando ( forms, breaking)
all the time over the last couple of years. sometimes they are even on
prime time!

David,
Once ESPN pays for that footage, it's pretty simple from there... They own it outright and figure, "Why pay for more when we have some already..." At least that's the way it looks to everyone. How many times have we all seen the same show over and over again..? MANY!

They just keep showing those ol shows as fillers over and over and over again. Some are 2, 3 even 4 years old and sometimes even older... Each year, what you see new is usually from "1" Event, but they cut it to make it look like there were tons of shows from around the world... Now thats a JOKE! 24 fights on 1 event so they can make 8 shows... Great to save $$$ but bad for the exposure of the fighters.

WE, IKF, want to give TV something new, fresh, EVERY MONTH if not EVERY WEEK! The others? They can't offer that because they don't sanction that many events. No stab here, it's true and it's that simple...

It makes us all angry... And frustrated...

Here's a sport that "IS" big around the world and "CAN" Grow even bigger, but may never get a chance on TV to do so because of...

OK... better stop there... no sense to spill the sour milk here...

what ever happened to the fight channel?

without any doubt dennis was a very good fc-fighter...may be the best in the fc-heavyweight like rofus ...but,when leg kicks are concerned they would never have a chance against people like "cikatic,longidinis" who have strong "muay thai or low kick system experience"...if he would have today again the opportunity to fight with low -kicks against such origin type of champs ,the result wouldn't be changed...

this is unfortunately always the same story,since "good boxing and high kicking abilities " do mostly not work against "rockhard leg kickers" with long year experiences...this is unfortunately mostly the general rule...

sandy wrote:

"like a few yanks your quick to shoot off ! "

Since you use the word "few". what if i told you that i know a "few" people from other countries that do the same? Looks like a little prejudging type of mentality. Like "yanks" as you put it are the only type of people that "shoot off".

Hey Ercan People are good in their enviroment. I'd like to see Stan the man, Cikatic or Hoost fight against the Olympic Tae Kwon Do champions under Tae Kwon Do rules.

It appears that some people want to point the finger at Alexio because he didn't do good in Leg Kicks. But the fact remains that none of those people had the balls to fight him in FC rules. To say someone isn't good because they can't fight under International rules is just like saying that the International rules fighters aren't any good because they can't fight under FC rules. To me a Mt fighter or a Leg kick fighter that is only good in their enviroment is no better then a FC fighter that is only good in his enviroment.
That is why I like to see people like Hoost,Kamen and Perry Ubeda. They have proven that they can fight in FC,low kick,Savate,MT and Perry Ubeda even did well in Tae Kwon Do!!

So to me anyone that is only good in their one style is no better then anyone else that is only good in their one style.

ok,
dread you have also right since visa versa the mt,low kick guys could not be so successful in fc bouts in general terms ...I remember the fight of hoost vs roufus in fc...roufus was playing in the ring, hoost had hard times and was making some little faults(like low kicks) which was counted...of course, a fighter like hoost was not easy even for roufus...it is not an easy concept for leg kickers (mt or kb/low kicks) to prevent their self kicking and leg block abilities...hence, they need at least 3-4 month prior for preperation for fc ,but even under those circumstance it is again not sufficient for success...
common general tendency:

-mt people can be successful "in oriental and western kb types with low kicks" if prepared enough ...(like kaman,carbin,çolak,yamali,royers did in the past and still many newcomers do...)visa versa they have much trouble in fc bouts like royers,kaman,hoost did in the past...

-fc people cannot so easy be successful in low kick bouts ...roufus, dennis,jackson were kings in their cathegories,but in other styles in vain...(by the way, urquidez's situation was different since he had chosen low kick bout and prepared good enough...

this is a very deep subject and there are many parameters why so and why not so...but you have right ...the fighters who can be successful in different disciplines need to have much respect than the single one havers...(like fred royers,kaman,carbin did in "fc,mt,kb-lowkicks and savate"...believe me ,it is not so easy concept to be successful in those sections all together...)

dread,
u miss the point.
if dennis said hey look,i'm a fc fighter 1st,but i'll give leg kicks a try and see how it goes.nobody would have batted an eye. but dennis,dennis himself proclaimed he was a leg kicker and that he can't be beaten under any rules.

dennis' mouth put him in that light.not us.

oh yeah kirk i got that point and i agree.

But i'm kinda talking in general.

OK, one thing that I should point out is that when Stan and Dennis fought it was not a case of arguing for months about what rules they would fight under. It was a given that they would fight International Rules. Dennis was fighting IR, and about 4 months prior to Stan he had even won the vacant ISKA title under leg kicks (or "Oriental Rules" as the title designation was at the time). Just like it was never an issue that Dennis and Branko would fight under watered down Muay Thai rules, or that Dennis would fight any of the several low kick bouts he fought. So saying others, be they Stan, Hoost, Cikatic etc had no balls to fight Dennis with above waist kicks is pointless as it was never an issue. So Dreadsen, that comment abot others having no balls is a moot point, and BTW if you were to pay ANYONE enough, they would fight under any rules you want.
Also worth pointing out that Stan, Branko, Hoost all started out as Full Contact fighters. In fact when Stan started fighting in 1983, low kicks were illegal in Australia anyway, and his first leg kick bout was in 1987.
Some people would be surprised at the amount of fighters, be they world renowned names or whoever, that started out fighting above the waist.
At the end of the day, Dennis was an excellent fighter, period. And this is coming from a guy who should bag Dennis :) His comments, the way he trashed opponents, the silly excuses and stories and whatnot should not blur the fact he lost only 2 fights and Dennis was no pushover under any style. You can name any big heavyweight name and chances are they've suffered a quick first round loss.

what a funny thread....i agree with Rockhard, take a trip to Lumpinee Goof and then tell us if u still think Muay Thai fighters can't kick above the waist, lol...they'd beat any full contact fighters easily...under any rules...and khas, the k-1 champ is from NZ not Australia, lol.

nick,

branco started fc(wako) ok (ý do not know the start of stan), but hoost hasn't ,since in holland there was a weak fc-publicum due to the roots..

vince,

it is not an easy concept to prevent the weapons like " jab ko, teh pub nok, sawk, kao etc" of an mt fighter ,then expect him to be successful also in american boxing(fc)...
you need much more time for preparation than you expect...(depending on the boxing handskill abilities there is at least a 3-4 months needed for preparations and adaptation...the methodology of training,technics used are very different...

Ercan, Hoost may not have started primarily as an above the waist fighter, though in his earlier days he had several bouts under FC rules.

mate i have nothing but respect for america in most things an the net is a great medium to share knowledge but an this may sound like a negative comment about amricans as a whole but in general an im not talking about most of the people on here but you gotta understand the " shooting off your mouth comment" is based on a perception that ppl like alexio won their titles in the usa fighting mostly hand picked usa fighters an than claim to be world champions.I think sometimes that america after sept 11 (worst thing ive ever seen)have realised that the world exists outside its own shores. I have a friend in the states who didnt know much about kickboxers outside of american up to last year an he claims to be a fan an if you asked him about international news all he knew was what was happening in the usa papers ??.
I've found the usa contributors on here very knowlegable an fair but i guess the net helps to open ppls mind on the world...shit that was too deep for me lol.

hes from samoa just like ray sefo but lived in nz south auckland like me an moved to australia cus umm the woman are ugly in nz so everyone claims him he does represents nz but lives resides eats sleeps an umm craps in australia.

was he born in samoa? didn't know that...he lived around the corner from me in Mangere for most of his life, and went to the same school...was best friends with my best mate's brother and even stayed over my house when i was younger when my parents went to Samoa....doesn't he go out to the k-1 ring with a nz flag??, anyways, no big deal...be an aussie..if u want to demote yourself, lol

and just in case...i'm not trying to jump on the Hunt bandwagon, and pretending i know him now...i haven;t seen him for years, and he prob doesn't even remember me..but i do support him, regardless of who he represents

i lived in a much better suburb called umm " otara heights " lol so yeh while i still barrack for the all blacks , them,mark hunt,chopper, supercharge,rexy an a few others are the only ppl i barrack for in nz cus as i said most of auckland is over here in brisbane living in crestmead, goodna an browns plains making the mc donalds franchise very rich lol . I cant bag australia cus well umm the economy is better, houses are cheaper,food is cheaper an umm most of the woman are under 100kgs lol unlike sth auckland.

Tangaroa aye, or is it Hillary...well, u can;t beat the food at Otara markets mate (i worked there for a few years, hehe)...lol, remind me of my cousin...asked her last year where she bought her new house, and she said 'Crofton Downs' or something like that...reckons it was a new suburb on the border of howick...i asked her sister later on, and whad ya know, it was a new housing development in the middle of Otara, lol...must visit Brisbane sometime, sounds alot warmer than Wgtn!

Does anyone know what he is up these days?